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Crossland CC1? - Page 2

Postby cpreston on Tue May 03, 2011 8:01 am

So to summarize... there is an existing Gee machine, not well regarded, that looks the same on the outside as the CC1. Some are posting, without any actual experience with the CC1, that it is likely the same as the existing Gee because it looks the same and is no doubt made by Gee.

Having spent many years in product design and development, I have often seen products completely transformed by a series of well-considered small tweaks that may not be visible. I am inclined to guess that Bill Crossland is more than capable of this, and would be very surprised if the only thing he changed is the badge.

But I guess we will have to wait.
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Postby JonR10 on Tue May 03, 2011 9:56 am

cpreston wrote:I am inclined to guess that Bill Crossland is more than capable of this, and would be very surprised if the only thing he changed is the badge.


+1
And if you had met Mr. Crossland in person then you might be even more inclined to think this way 8)
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Postby chang00 on Tue May 03, 2011 10:35 am

Last year I saw this machine at the 2010 SCAA. I recognized the similarity to GEE and asked Mr Crossland. He did not give me a direct answer, but a diplomatic response. Due to fund, time, cost, etc, etc, and to bring a machine to market quicker, the GEE was chosen. We also talked about the CC2 and its temperature management idea. In fact, from my recollection, he was more eager to discuss the CC2 rather than the CC1. As Jon mentioned earlier, he is an engineer's engineer.

As stated earlier and again, I just want to know exactly what improvements were made. It does not imply anything otherwise. Perhaps HB can run a side by side comparison once the CC1 is released.
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Postby da gino on Tue May 03, 2011 10:55 am

chang00 wrote:The CC1 is a re-badged Gee espresso machine.


chang00 wrote: I just want to know exactly what improvements were made.


These quotes contradict each other. One claims to know that it is a re-badged machine, the other implies that you don't know if it is a re-badged or if improvements were made. I don't know anything about the machine, but given his reputation I would guess the latter and that the improvements were dramatic. Crossland has a reputation as a great guy and a great engineer, perhaps you should email him and ask instead of just asserting things as fact.
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Postby SlowRain on Tue May 03, 2011 11:26 am

I'd say 're-badged' was simply an error in choosing words. Henry has made it clear, through multiple posts now, that he has always been aware of changes made to it. Perhaps 're-engineered' or 're-worked' is closer to the word he was originally looking for.
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Postby hankua on Tue May 03, 2011 12:12 pm

Chang00 is a respected member of HB along with Mr. Crossland. Chang00 watches the Asian coffee scene, and chimes in from time to time with background information. Mr. Crossland may very well have a proprietary design for his machine, and wants to keep it quiet. Is it surprising to hear there may be a CC2 on the drawing board? Just the fact that the CC1 is getting some buzz is a good thing. :D
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Postby Billc on Tue May 03, 2011 12:57 pm

Hello y'all or really I should say - hello all y'all. Thanks JONR for the lesson in Texas speak.

Just returned from the show last night. WOW what a show thanks for all of your great response and your kind words. Kind of humbling when you get to talk with some of the greats in the industry. Dan even stopped by the booth and said hello. What an honor!

OK so there seems to be some confusion over the CC1 machine. The base for this machine was the GEE machine from Taiwan. I met Ewen from Gee quite some time ago and consider him a good friend. I have been there several times and he is a great guy. Ewen and I are both engineers that have similar aspirations and goals and originally I was going to build my other espresso machine at his company before I delayed the project. Ewen designed the Gee machine and when I saw it I was impressed with some of the features it had. The company is family owned and has a couple of employees.
During some of our talks we decided to look at the market that the Gee was designed for and found that it was missing some of the features that the home barista enthusiasts were asking for. So we embarked on a project to modify the existing platform to increase the performance and add some features.

Here is a list of features on the CC1 Machine:
1 - ETL Safety Approval for USA and Canada
2 - Commercial size 58mm Portafilter basket
3 - 3 way Brew Valve
4 - Electronic temperature control with PID
5 - Swivel Type Steam wand
6 - 500 mL Stainless steel Brew Boiler
7 - Separate steam block for steam
8 - Programmable pre-infusion
9 - Volumetric programming by time
10 - Shot timer
11 - 3 programmable menu selections
(Temperature, pre-infusion settings, and shot time)

Yes, the badge is changed but I think you will find that this is a different machine. We are just beginning the testing process with customers and there should be some reviews coming out soon.

Hope this clears up some of the discussion topics. Thank for the kinds words!

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Postby coffee.me on Tue May 03, 2011 1:17 pm

I have to say this:

YAY! The Chinese(well, Taiwanese) are FINALLY coming! The Italians could sure use some healthy competition. From Henry's link, GEE has another, more sophisticated, machine. Skip the 1st 3 minutes of this video and enjoy watching an espresso machine that's not designed in the 80's:




Besides being from Taiwan and very different from anything else I've seen, I don't know much about this bigger machine. Even with that, it sure looks like some exciting things are coming our way; well, eventually.

A bit more about this bigger machine here: http://gee-coffee.com/coffee_machine_pr...chine.html
"Beans before machines" --coffee.me ;-)
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Postby Billc on Tue May 03, 2011 1:40 pm

This is the GEE commercial machine. If you are interested I do have one at my home. Currently is it not available in the USA but could bring it over if requested. 220V models only and has a vibe pump. The boiler is pretty big but could be modified to make it 110V. Let me know if you think there would be interest.

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Postby coffee.me on Tue May 03, 2011 1:53 pm

Well, Bill, the GEE commercial sure looks intriguing. The "Instruction Manual" link on it's webpage doesn't work. But from the video above it looks like:

- the hot water dispensing time & temp can be programmed,
- there seems to be two pressure gauges for brew and boiler,
- five program buttons (A - E).

What else can you tell us?
"Beans before machines" --coffee.me ;-)
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