Brand new Rancilio Silvia - coffee pouring way too quick

Need help with equipment usage or want to share your latest discovery?
Ecoce1
Posts: 2
Joined: 9 years ago

#1: Post by Ecoce1 »

Hello to everyone.

My father is a big espresso lover. He has had the same espresso machine for the past 6 years. I decided to suprise him for his birthday and get him the rancilio silvia v3 machine. From everything I read it was the best machine for the money.

Yesterday he opened the machine. Was very excited. We followed all instructions and made the first cup. The coffee that came out was just regular black coffee and did not look like an espresso shot. We figured that it might just be the type of grind, even though the previous machine used the same coffee and always made a nice shot.

So we went and bought more coffee and made sure that it was grinded as fine as possible. The results were the same. The coffee is just coming out black. It looks like the machine is more like a keurig at this point. I am guessing the temperature is not hot enough. I watched some videos online and it seems the machine we got is pouring out water way too quick. The cup is filled within 10 seconds (double shot).

We did try leaving the machine on for over 30 minutes just to see if that would help. It did not.

I am guessing we got a defective machine. I already wrote to the seller, but figured I ask people that use these machine everyday for your opinions. Maybe I am doing something wrong. It is very disappointing, I thought that my dad would be impressed by the espresso, but instead i got myself an expensive tea kettle.

Any help is appreciated.

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HB
Admin
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#2: Post by HB »

Sounds like Espresso newbie help - pour times too fast and a dozen other threads. I doubt it's the espresso machine; either the coffee is stale, the grinder is inadequate, or the grind setting is too coarse. See Newbie Introduction to Espresso (videos) and How to Adjust Dose and Grind Setting by Taste.

You didn't mention the grinder. Perhaps yours is not up to the task? Keep in mind that the Rancilio Silvia does not use a pressurized portafilter and it demands a good grinder.
Dan Kehn

Ecoce1 (original poster)
Posts: 2
Joined: 9 years ago

#3: Post by Ecoce1 (original poster) »

Yea, I do not have a grinder at all. My dad went without using one for over 6 years, so I figured whats the point?...but I did some more research just now, and it seems that I bought him half the machine (without the grinder, the machine is not complete). I am doing some research, to see which grinder would be best. So far I believe my choices are: Rocky, Baratza Virtuoso Preciso grinder, Mini Mazzer or Compact K3.

In reference to the above problem that I had. My father was the one that was using the machine last night, so I decided to play around with it now. I put a lot more coffee in to the double shot holder. Basically to the point where the handle would not even close, and i just kept removing the coffee until it locked in...A whole different story now. The machine worked perfect. The coffee came out nice and slow, and looked like espresso instead of just black coffee.

I apologize for asking newbie question. Seems that I just did not know how to use the machine.

I guess next thing is to get a grinder, to complete the set. If anyone is selling their used one, let me know. These grinders seem to cost just as much as the Silvia.

LukeFlynn
Posts: 1293
Joined: 10 years ago

#4: Post by LukeFlynn »

Ecoce1 wrote:Yea, I do not have a grinder at all. My dad went without using one for over 6 years, so I figured whats the point?...but I did some more research just now, and it seems that I bought him half the machine (without the grinder, the machine is not complete). I am doing some research, to see which grinder would be best. So far I believe my choices are: Rocky, Baratza Virtuoso Preciso grinder, Mini Mazzer or Compact K3.

In reference to the above problem that I had. My father was the one that was using the machine last night, so I decided to play around with it now. I put a lot more coffee in to the double shot holder. Basically to the point where the handle would not even close, and i just kept removing the coffee until it locked in...A whole different story now. The machine worked perfect. The coffee came out nice and slow, and looked like espresso instead of just black coffee.

I apologize for asking newbie question. Seems that I just did not know how to use the machine.

I guess next thing is to get a grinder, to complete the set. If anyone is selling their used one, let me know. These grinders seem to cost just as much as the Silvia.
A grinder is critical. I would skip the Rocky, and the baratza - the rocky's grind quality for espresso is immensely lackluster. The Mazzer Mini is a decent grinder, but I think the Compact K3 will surpass it in grind quality. I think Mazzer does great with their conicals and larger flats (SJ & Major), the mini also leaves a lot to be desired.. I hear you can put SJ Burrs on it though, which might be cool. The reason why your Dad could get shots without a grinder before is likely because his previous machine had a pressurized portafilter that added faux crema to the shot to make it seem like espresso. With proper technique, your dad will probably be blown away. Did you opt for the PID on your silvia? I don't want to degrade your purchase decision, and in no way is my opinion indicative to the machine being incapable of producing espresso, but the Silvia was great for the money 5-10 years ago. Within the last 5 years there have been some singe boilers that surpass it.. like the Crossland CC1. I had a Silvia with a PID from February of last year to Decemeber.. It took me 10 months to get to a decent spot with that machine, and my espresso improved immensely after switching away from the Silvia. Given your Dad had an essentially worry free espresso machine, the Silvia could prove tedious to him.. Temperature surfing and dealing with Silvia's own problems on top of learning how to extract espresso is a headache. Ultimately, it doesn't matter what I think of the Silvia. Use it, let your dad use it, then see how he likes it - that will be the ultimate determining factor.

BillRedding
Posts: 205
Joined: 9 years ago

#5: Post by BillRedding »

Ecoce1,

After your initial "speed bump" in your (and your Father's) espresso journey, it seems you're on your way to getting good espresso, so my post here is probably moot. Regardless, I wanted to chime-in anyway and say that it's definitely NOT the Rancilio Silvia, so no, you did not get a "defective" machine.

Also remember that MANY of us here started-out on a Silvia...and WE didn't get defective machines, either. Even if the Silvia is not the BEST choice for a SBDU machine nowadays, it still is a high-quality SBDU machine (mine never gave me any trouble, unlike some stories about the "way better CC1" machines I've read about online). I still have my Silvia (awaiting a good home) but probably will keep my Rancilio Rocky doserless grinder that I paired with Silvia, so I can use the Rocky exclusively for Drip or French-Press grinding (if I ever do that in the future).

So, just giving a simple answer here: When espresso comes out of the portafilter TOO FAST it's very likely the grind is TOO COARSE.

[this assumes the dose and tamp are correct, so if both ARE, then too fast = too coarse grind, period.]

It's an easy fix though: You adjust your grinder towards the "fine" side and try again, and if necessary repeat the process until you "dial-in" the proper setting for the beans you are using (brand/roasting level).

Of course, the first step it to have a grinder...which you are in the process of doing presently. :-)

And yes, a grinder IS expensive (expensive defined a bit differently by everyone) but it's cost is relative. Meaning (as in this case), since a Silvia is $600-700, yes, a good grinder will start around that same price, but with more expensive espresso machines, the grinder's price start to fall lower compared to the machine's price. For extreme example: If you buy a $6K espresso machine, you do NOT need an $6K grinder to go with it! You can GET one if you want, but NO WAY do you "need" it. A $1600 or so grinder will do VERY well. Yes, that's still "expensive" to most people, but remember, in the Espresso Kingdom decent and better espresso equipment just costs MORE...no way around it. They don't sell prosumer-level machines/grinders at your local Walmart, Target or appliance store. But there IS a limit: A $6K machine doesn't produce "$6K better" espresso than a $2K machine does...but people upgrade for various reasons (mine is for more expensive "art objects" that also happen to make espresso, but not in hope of getting clearly "better" espresso).

You don't have to keep "upgrading" after a certain price-point because you really HAVE to, it's likely because you just WANT to.

Still, there IS a minimum "threshold" cost level you must "entertain" when looking for a good entry-level grinder for espresso (Drip and French Press are different). The consensus here seems to be good espresso grinders start around $500. You can cut that cost somewhat by looking for a good (gently) used grinder or, a store's "open-box" or "refurbished" grinder.

However you get one, when you DO have it, your Father will be having some great espresso!

At least you've seen some improvement, so you no longer think your Silvia is defective -- and that is some good news.

Good luck,

-- BR