Juanjo wrote:2- is to get a 5000W transformer, I been told twice that would be safe to run this 2500w machine on a 15A 110V outlet.

End result will be either:

1 - Immediate tripping of the breaker as you try to draw around 2500W (plus transformer loss - so let's say 2800W as a guess) through a circuit breaker that will only support around 1800W before tripping, or

2 - Fire

Either result = bad.

Juanjo wrote:THANKS again for all the replies..
2- is to get a 5000W transformer, I been told twice that would be safe to run this 2500w machine on a 15A 110V outlet.

Without some changes, it won't work. Your max power is 15A x 110V = 1650 Watts. Only IF you can get the current draw to be at most 15A will it be possible (once stepped up, that would be 7.5 Amps through a 220V connection).

Mark

I called on the phone the guy who sells this transformer http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0175910889 and explained my situation (220v espresso machine with 2500w heat element which will be ON for 40minutes + when I first turn it on) and he told me that the 3000w transformer will not work, but that 5000w on the link will..

I was ready to give it a try, but now looks like I have only option 1 (or 3!?)

regardless, thanks again.

Hi guys,

I'd seriously let it go and sell the machine, looks like you'll need a proper 220VAC installation with nice thick wires before you can plug it in (drawing around 12A isn't too much, but I always tend to go a bit over the top, allowing for around 10-20% backup, just in case, this goes for breakers, SSRs, wires).

Just out of curiosity as I never really understood this, why is US using 110VAC? it means using thicker wires for most stuff as the current is twice (even more) of what you get with 230VAC.

Regards,
dsc.

dsc wrote:Just out of curiosity as I never really understood this, why is US using 110VAC? it means using thicker wires for most stuff as the current is twice (even more) of what you get with 230VAC.

Historical and safety reasons. Google found several longer explanations, e.g., Why does the US run at 120V? and What is the advantage of using 240 volts instead of 120 volts?

Juanjo wrote:I called on the phone the guy who sells this transformer http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0175910889 and explained my situation (220v espresso machine with 2500w heat element which will be ON for 40minutes + when I first turn it on) and he told me that the 3000w transformer will not work, but that 5000w on the link will..

I was ready to give it a try, but now looks like I have only option 1 (or 3!?)

regardless, thanks again.

That guy is WRONG! Watts is watts, at a different voltage the AMPS change to compensate. Wire heating and the resulting fires are due to too many amps (a wire is basically the same thing as a heating element in your boiler). I'd make a recommendation on how you could possibly safely run this machine without new wiring if I hadn't gotten some really bad vibes. Just hire an electrician or get a different machine.

Sometimes you're not even safe with professional work. When I tried to install some GFI outlets in my kitchen, I got sparks and smoke. I thought "What gives? I followed all the directions." We brought in an electrician who showed us how the builder had misconnected the original wiring, so that none of the standard wire colors meant what they were supposed to mean. Yikes! The electrician fixed it and put in the GFI outlets for us.

I should also mention that 220v wiring tends to get more complicated in pre-1980's homes. Most of the ovens and stovetops were gas then. So there was no need for 220v power in the kitchen (if the laundry machines were in a separate area). This means you have to run the new wiring to the kitchen all the way from the main panel, as we did. They had to rip through so much ceiling footage, we went into "while we're at it" mode and installed new lighting.

Juanjo wrote:I been told twice that would be safe to run this 2500w machine on a 15A 110V outlet (with a transformer).

Using a transformer will be a less expensive option and will not require any construction. This will be less expensive than running a dedicated 220v line. Keep in mind the circuit is rated at 1650W and you are running a 2500W boiler PLUS all the other electrical components of the machine PLUS every other appliance hooked up to that line in the building, so most likely you will trip the circuit breaker when you the boiler starts to heat up. So long as the line is connected to a fuse or a circuit breaker, it won't start any fires. What will occur is that the power will go off for everything on that line every time the fuse blows or circuit breaker trips.

(Now, some people have been known to bypass this by replacing the fuses with pennies. THAT will start a fire, since the line will then flow current beyond its capacity and physically break down.)

At the very least, you ought to trace out what OTHER outlets are connected to the line you plan to utilize, and remove all other appliances from that line. You can do this by reading the schematic, or simply by turning off the circuit breaker at the panel and testing the outlets to see which ones have gone off. These will all be connected to the same line. Nothing else should be used on these outlets when your espresso maker is working. This will reduce the possibility of tripping the circuit breaker.

THEN, if and when this does not give an adequate result, you can get the electrician to put in a dedicated line. You will need to run it from the mains and possibly the power pole transformer to get sufficient current flow at the correct rating. If you put in a 220V dedicated line to a dedicated single outlet, a 30-40A rating will be a good choice. If you choose to use the transformer you have purchased and stay with a 110V dedicated line to a dedicated outlet, a 60-80A rating will be advisable. These are conservative numbers and most people get by with less, but if you are going to the trouble of doing this, you may as well do it right and be safe. You may have to go to the power pole since that type of capacity is generally what will be dedicated to the mains supply for your entire apartment.

Good luck with your new monthly electricity bill!

dsc wrote:Why is US using 110VAC? it means using thicker wires for most stuff as the current is twice (even more) of what you get with 230VAC.

The short answer is:

1) Devices rated for 220V were originally more expensive to manufacture.
2) 110V is a tiny bit safer if you touch the bare wires by mistake.
3) 110V is fine for low power devices, which comprised most electrical household devices before television was invented.
4) It was a bit arbitrary, as there is not a huge difference, but you have to pick SOME number.
5) It would be a big effort to change to 220V at this point in the USA. We will get to that after we finish the national health care plan, okay?

drdna wrote:Keep in mind the circuit is rated at 1650W and you are running a 2500W boiler PLUS all the other electrical components of the machine PLUS every other appliance hooked up to that line in the building, so most likely you will trip the circuit breaker when you the boiler starts to heat up. So long as the line is connected to a fuse or a circuit breaker, it won't start any fires. What will occur is that the power will go off for everything on that line every time the fuse blows or circuit breaker trips.

Sean Lennon once warned me that typical home circuit breakers don't trip at precisely their rating and should not be used as "device testers" (wikipedia's Types of circuit breakers provides background information). A closed circuit will trip the breakers immediately, but a heating element could overload the circuit just enough to melt portions of the wiring insulation without the breaker cutting power (e.g., at the outlet connection points).

But rather than listening to any of our speculation, however well intended, and rather than worry about what may work and what may not, here's my recommendation: Get an evaluation from a licensed electrician. He/she can go on site, inspect the wiring, circuit breakers, existing appliance loads, and confirm/refute options. It won't cost more than a trip charge + 30 minutes. I know I'd sleep a lot better going with the recommendation of a licensed electrician who's actually seen my house than the guesswork of DIYers from an online forum!