RyanJE wrote:Not to veer too off topic, but I certainly don't get it! Maybe I am just expecting too much from freezing and brewed coffee is a bit more effected by degradation...

I do recall in the freezing coffee study by Ken and Jim they tested via cupping and could spot the frozen beans. Add the fact they froze immediately post roast in -15 temps....

I wouldn't know but I'd suggest a deep freezer. There is a 'coffee freezer counter' available. A search will find it for sure.
I personally would never use anything under -20C freezer, but that's because I've got several of them available.

But in the end it's like with fish, do you want your fish fresh or with a few days delay? Or do you want to use your freezer to extend that 'life span'. Do you want your coffee fresh or with a few months delay? Or would you want to consider deep freezing? Obviously if you regurlarly roast your own beans, you wouldn't have to think these things.

RyanJE wrote:Im not sure this comparison make sense to me? One would expect coffee stored at room temp to stale quicker than frozen.

I thought the question was how best to store a couple of bags of coffee if it's going to take about a month to drink that much. It's something I face from time to time when I've ordered several bags of coffee. Now it's true that opening the bags every other day isn't the same as leaving them sealed. But the thing is, the coffee that was in the freezer stayed pretty much the same the whole time (about a month) unlike the room temperature coffee. Based on that I can't see any reason not to keep my coffee in the freezer, even if I just have 250g of it (like I do right now). Why leave it at room temperature, ever?

RyanJE wrote:Had airscapes and found them a pain, sold them. I still can't see a better solution for freshness and ease of use then valve bags. In fact, I bought a pack of 20 thick bags with zip tops to use as well when needed. Zip tops are easier then twisty type, IMHO.

Also. I wouldn't freeze anymore than you need to. Keep out whatever you will consume with 14 days post roast.

Also IMHO, freezing works better for espresso than brewed coffee. I don't know why, but to me coffee frozen for brew just doesn't work as well.

What is a pain about the Airscape? I just got mine today and filled it with the first bag I plan on using and it seems awesome. I pushed the inner lid down to the beans, but the outer lid on top and the first time I took the lid off I couldn't even smell coffee so I knew it was sealed tight.

Stolen from one of the previous Golden Oldies discussions from HB: http://www.ielogical.com/coffee/FrzCalc/FrzCalc.php

berfles wrote:What is a pain about the Airscape? I just got mine today and filled it with the first bag I plan on using and it seems awesome. I pushed the inner lid down to the beans, but the outer lid on top and the first time I took the lid off I couldn't even smell coffee so I knew it was sealed tight.

In my opinion the process of opening and closing 2 lids (one of them really slow) and using a scoop for the beans was a pain. On my zip top valve bags I open the bag dump out my dose and close it.

But really again, to each his own. I had two airscapes an sold them because I personally did not like them.

Nick Name wrote:Stolen from one of the previous Golden Oldies discussions from HB: http://www.ielogical.com/coffee/FrzCalc/FrzCalc.php

That's an ingenuous tool, have certainly used it before. Unfortunately my experience when freezing for brewed coffee is that it doesn't last as long as the calc would have you think. Frozen beans brewed as espresso though seem to hold up better...

TO ME after a few weeks in the freezer beans brewed as coffee just lose character... you can make the same coffee everyday for a month (or two) and taste the change from when it's first roasted....

Nick Name wrote:Stolen from one of the previous Golden Oldies discussions from HB: http://www.ielogical.com/coffee/FrzCalc/FrzCalc.php

I've looked at that before but I'm not sure what to do with it exactly. Should I try and drink freezer coffee faster as the supposed expiration date is approaching?

I've had coffee in the freezer last a lot longer than suggested by his empirical formula. So maybe there's another variable or three he isn't considering? I don't really know. One point he acknowledges on his website (and the accompanying HB thread on the subject) is that it seems lighter roasts last longer than darker roasts in the freezer. Perhaps that's one reason I have success with freezing.

A few months back I was cleaning out my freezer and found half a bag buried in the back that had been misplaced for a year. The coffee was fabulous, bursting with fruit. I wished I'd misplaced more of it.

RyanJE wrote:TO ME after a few weeks in the freezer beans brewed as coffee just lose character... you can make the same coffee everyday for a month (or two) and taste the change from when it's first roasted....

Just curious -- how do you make the comparison? By memory? Or do you buy (or roast) a supposedly identical coffee?

One thing seems clear to me. After a month the coffee at room temperature will have lost more character than the one in the freezer. And in the short term, freezing doesn't take anything way -- that I can detect -- from the coffee when compared to leaving it at room temperature.

Maybe your palate is more sensitive than mine. Does coffee taste off to you after one day in the freezer? One week?

Lately I've taken to storing individual pre-weighed doses of coffee in glass jars in the freezer. This way when I'm ready to make my espresso, I can take a jar from the freezer, single-dose grind, tamp and pull. The rest of the coffee stays sealed and frozen, no risk of aging at all. I trust the study that was done here showing that freezing coffee for at least 8 weeks has no effect in its quality, and I've observed this myself, the last shot from a bag pulls just as good and tastes the same as the first. Now this is for espresso only, I don't know of any such high quality study done for brewed coffee. I use 2 oz jars and they can fit up to ~19g of medium-dark roasted beans, but anywhere between 17-19g fills the jar up mostly. For brewed coffee, higher doses may need a 3 or 4oz jar. Many options can be found on amazon. I fill jars and freeze when the coffee hits the sweet spot of age.

jpender wrote:Just curious -- how do you make the comparison? By memory? Or do you buy (or roast) a supposedly identical coffee?

One thing seems clear to me. After a month the coffee at room temperature will have lost more character than the one in the freezer. And in the short term, freezing doesn't take anything way -- that I can detect -- from the coffee when compared to leaving it at room temperature.

Maybe your palate is more sensitive than mine. Does coffee taste off to you after one day in the freezer? One week?

I think my point was being missed. I am not comparing coffee in a freezer for 1 month to coffee sitting at room temp for a month.

I am saying, as an example, freeze some coffee at post roast day 3 and leave some out to last up to 14 days post roast.. When I drink that same coffee after its been frozen for a month or two, it does not taste the same as it did in the 3-14 days post roast window.

Try it yourself. Get a fresh coffee freeze some and leave some out, drink it for 5 days. A month (or two even) later take the frozen coffee out and see it it still has the same character.

To me, it loses something. Thats why I say I dont think that calculator represents what actually happens. It would tell me that my frozen coffee only ages 1 days per 16 in storage. Meaning if I freeze at day 3 I still have 3-4 months to brew it in the equivalent freshness window. My findings are more like I have maybe a month at best.

No doubt, its better than leaving at room temp for a month though!