Jim piqued my curiosity so I got some Miscela Massini as well. This is nice, nicer than Miscela D'Oro. Little bit more restrained but still in your face smoke, leather and brandy. Sometimes I managed to turn that brandy into Jamaican Rum and that was super tasty in milk drinks. Actually this blend is really nice in milk drinks.

If you wonder how would this taste fresh, try Stella Suprema. It is similar in taste profile and it gets closer and closer to Miscela Massini but only after 7 days of rest and onwards (it really needs that rest). It is more restrained in that smoke/leather/brandy category and I like it... I believe it has Robusta beans as well.

I picked up some of the Masini blend. While i also got the leathery, brandyish tastes at 14g, 199degrees, after lowering the temp a couple of degrees, going down to a 13.5g dose, i get what tastes to me like a more balanced shot, a bit more chocolaty than leathery and even some fruit in there. However, as Jim says, not much in the way of zingy aromatics. Although I frequently buy locally roasted beans from the various San Francisco shops, i'm actually pretty happy with this Essse cafe blend, it seems pleasant, perhaps in contrast to some of the brighter local blends.

Andrew

Seriously??

I don't know whether to be happy that people are only now beginning to realize that we're not all sheep (enjoying the same beans/roasts/blends/equipment/technique), or sad that it takes a proclamation (or revelation), from one of The Respecteds on the subject, in order to get people to think about it.

From my observations, it's most likely a combination of beanset (blend & roast), machine mechanics, brewing technique (both as dictated by the machine (& they all dictate different requirements) & as developed by the owner), and acquired tastes of the drinker.

In other words, it's not just a matter of "which beans to buy?", but also "how will my machine make it?" as well as understanding "where do my tastes run?" (as in, "what wine varietals or beer styles (or whatever you think may be applicable) do I already know I prefer?")

Got a $6-megabuck brewer? You're getting different results than those using $2-megabuck brewers, who are getting different results than the rest of us using sub-megabuck brewers. I've had the same beanset brewed thru two divergant grinder/brewer setups. The first one cost roughly $10,000, & produced the finest array of nuances in the cup that I could ever imagine. The second one cost under $1,000, & could only succeed in extracting a burnt flavor profile.

Do you like Merlot? Or Pinot Noir? Then perhaps your preferred beanset is going to be markedly different from someone who likes Barolo or Amarone. Your preferences (and experiences) are going to color your flavor interpretations.

another_jim wrote:... This is not what we consider artisan coffee roasting, i.e. the quest to bring out the natural excellence of each coffee; instead it is coffee engineering to get a taste of distinction that has nothing to do with natural coffee flavors, and everything to do with the flavors preferred by picky Italian espresso drinkers (this is a premium miscela).

Clearly, the artisan and engineering approaches are two ends of the coffee roasting spectrum. ...

I guess I don't see the difference between the two terms you've chosen to use. Sure, I understand what you mean; that a larger business is interested more in profits than in "perfection."
Maybe.
It certainly happens often enough here in the U.S., as you pointed out. (And perhaps Illy is the U.S.-company-equivalent.)

But I also know that the best "artisans" are superb "engineers" of their craft. I think that if you were to ask an "artisan" in just about any discipline (not just coffee roasting) about their "process of creation," you'll find a huge amount of passion for understanding the precise mechanisms that affect their results.
A painter is keenly aware of how a single color detail affects an entire scene.
A sculptor is continuously tweaking the nooks & protrusions that make up a piece.
A chef is always thinking how an herb might elevate (or ruin) a meal.
These are "engineers" at the highest level of awareness of their craft.

Obviously, you're equating "artisan" with "passionate," maybe even with "sacrifice." But to imply that larger blender/roasters are any less "artisanal" completely dismisses the painstaking trials it took to create their product. Again, I understand your point. We all like to believe that a passionate individual will always create a superior item when compared to that of the soul-less corporation. But, sometimes, it's simply just a more expensive, less-well researched item.

Mind you, I have nothing against small business operations. I hope to start one myself, within the next year. But let's look at the "artisans" a little more truthfully. They're providing options for the consumer.
Period.
Those options aren't always better than what's currently available, but they can be.
Frequently, they're more "rustic" than what a larger company is expected to produce.
If the consumer doesn't want those options, then the "artisan" is no longer able to support himself in that endeavor. In the end, we're all concerned with profits, both craftsman & corporation alike.

Don't presume that the "artisan's" product will always surpass what's commonly available. Ingredients, equipment, tastes, & even personalities are far too varied for such a biased notion.

Eiron wrote: ... or sad that it takes a proclamation (or revelation), from one of The Respecteds on the subject, in order to get people to think about it.

+1

Oh my, I was sure that micro roaster and artisans were doing this job and were harsh on companies such as Illy only because they were philantrop and idealist not ever thinking of improving their profits.

This site, CG and others have defined the demand in US and rest of the world. Guides, Howtos and tests defined the dogma of home espresso and what's heretic (Lavazzilly, 14g dose, 50ml shots, under 800$ machine, less than 15kg grinder, lever like temp profiles,etc...)

If it had been told and told here and there that no one could do a better job at blending than some italian roaster and their 90 years of skills, there will be a very very narrow market for micro roaster and 20$ coffee bags...

I still consider that specialty coffee and geeky culture is a very good thing for improving coffee taste and quality, but seeing ONLY this side of the market is quite naive, I think. The best example is the higher price paid by an espresso passionate for his coffee and his equipment in America. It indicates that some people/company are making serious profits, and I guess they are happy with (I would).

I think a lot of this simply has to do with personal preference and then letting a particular impression stay foremost in the mind.

Much of the recent experimentation with SO espressos has led to aficionados developing a preference for bright, zingy, fruity acidity which is quite alien to "Italian" preferences and indeed what many people assume espresso "should" be like. To that extent it's an acquired taste, if acquired at all (possibly because of limitations in equipment or technique).

Some posters who have acquired the taste have stated they find Italian blends a little cloying after a time. Frankly, I find anything gets a bit tiring after a time, so I change beans quite frequently, rotating favourites that would lose their lustre for me if I had to drink them all the time. Fortunately this isn't an either/or situation and I can keep ringing the changes and smiling.

Which is why I welcome anyone re-evaluting their preferences and assumptions (including me ).

Cheers

Mike

"This is seemingly confirmed at the World Barista Championships, where the Italian baristas, with smooth and somewhat arrogant competence, serve up flawlessly boring and mediocre shots that don't come close to making the cut."

I'm glad you added the word "seemingly". I don't know how a WBC works, so I have to be careful. But if it is anything like a wine tasting, I'm not surprised that classic Italian espresso doesn't come close to making the cut. The winner in such a contest usually is a "remarkable" or "interesting" wine, but that doesn't mean it is a wine you'd like to drink on it's own, outside of the contest. 10 yrs or so ago I often compared a few bottles of wine with some friends, and more often than not the winning bottle turned out to be very tiring to the palate when drunk the day after, perfectly impossible to combine with food, etc. In the end, I started to feel that "boring" and "mediocre" actually were signs that the wine was fine.