Geisha tips

Discuss flavors, brew temperatures, blending, and cupping notes.
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shawndo
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#1: Post by shawndo »

I've seen a lot written about Geisha coffee, but never have tried it. I've been keeping an eye on Temple's website and finally noticed they have a Geisha offering again.
Not cheap, but I really wanted to try it so I can at least checkmark that box in the back of my head.

It will be a couple weeks before the next roast date and now all I'm thinking about is how to get the best out of this quickly without wasting a lot of coffee on experimenting.

So, if you were getting a pound of this coffee, what would you do with it?
espresso, v60? kone vs filter, etc?
Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra

kwantfm
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#2: Post by kwantfm »

IMO V60 is the way to go... I don't think a Kone would capture the nuances well. I often roast gesha for espresso, but think that the degree of distinctiveness diminishes as the drop temperature increases.
LMWDP #602

jhors2
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#3: Post by jhors2 »

+1 V60. I have brewed 4 different Geishas at this point with the following:

Hario Skerton Grinder

20g in 300g out

50g bloom pour (stir like crazy to degas and agitate)
70g pour (wait to drain)
60g pour (wait to drain)
60g pour (wait to drain)
60g pour

Geishas seem to bitter very quickly if the water temp is too high in my experience, I always insure my brew water starting at first pour is about 94.5c.

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Peppersass
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#4: Post by Peppersass »

+1 on a filtered brew method. I haven't been able to get a good cup pulling Geisha as espresso.

Frankly, my feeling is that Geisha is over-rated. That could be a matter of personal taste. It has some interesting and subtle nuances, and can be comforting in a tea-like way, but I'm not into flowery, jasmine type flavors in coffee.

Alan Frew
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#5: Post by Alan Frew »

My tip is that unless it's at a line ball price for other high end coffees, don't waste your money. I cupped the "original" Best of Panama Gesha way back when, I've yet to taste or score an equal Gesha from any source that comes close. On the other hand, I've cupped three DP Panama bourbons since 2012 which were just as good.

Brewing wise, drip, aeropress, plunger or syphon; none of the high end Panamas are well suited to espresso if correctly roasted.

Alan

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CoffeeBar
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#6: Post by CoffeeBar »

Peppersass wrote:
Frankly, my feeling is that Geisha is over-rated. That could be a matter of personal taste. .
+1, In my humble opinion, the taste just took weak for me( taste like drinking some Chinese tea ) :D

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shadowfax
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#7: Post by shadowfax »

Some of my most memorable coffees have been geishas.
  • George Howell's La Esmeralda Mario San Jose (no longer available, but Panama La Esmeralda Mario Carnaval might be a suitable replacement). I got this one in 2014, and enjoyed beautiful, sweet balanced espresso shots rife with delicate, floral flavors.
  • Inteligentsia's Finca Takesi collection has been an eye-opener in the years I've purchased it. I've only ever cupped it, as it's incredibly expensive. I think you only get about 60g of it in an order, so espresso is just not an option. When cupped, this one is always bracingly floral and sweet for me, and a wonderfully clean flavor. It's definitely on the lighter side of body, so if you judge coffee on that and prefer heavier stuff, a washed geisha is probably not for you.
  • Colombia Cerro Azul geisha - I got this one from PT's coffee a couple years ago, and loved it as espresso and pourover. It was expensive, but much cheaper than most any washed geisha from Panama, and (I thought) had a pretty similar character.
It surely is all a matter of taste. For me, the best geishas I've had are deeply floral, delicate, and sweet in a way that is unlike any other coffee I've had. It's not "better," and is quite expensive for what it is. I approach it as a fun treat once in awhile, not something I'd want as a bread-and-butter coffee, even if it were affordable to do so. And I've had geishas that were not so great and pretty overpriced. If you aren't OK with that, you might want to avoid them-it surely is frustrating to drop $150 on a pound of coffee and have it be sub-par.

I've only ever pulled geishas as espresso on my Slayer, with very long, slow "preinfusion" (restricted flow, not "line pressure"). IMO it works wonderfully, and certainly I don't think you'd be able to get a decent shot from a geisha on an espresso machine without such a feature; maybe if you used an EK43 or similar "bulk" grinder? I don't know.

As for brewing, I don't think I'd get too worked up about selecting the brewing method. I'd suggest using a method that you like and are comfortable with. What do you use to brew a light roasted, washed Yirgacheffe? I'd bet you'd enjoy a washed geisha coffee using the same brewing method.
Nicholas Lundgaard

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another_jim
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#8: Post by another_jim »

The original Esmeralda and the Cerro Azul were outstanding and balanced coffees, whose caramels developed beautiful hazelnut notes that complemented the florals. Any brew method was simple and great for these, except espresso, which were finicky to pull and uneven in quality. The others I've tried (I missed the once Nicholas has mentioned) do best at very light roasts and very fine grinds. The "tea-like" remark is somewhat accurate.

I'm guessing the tea-like ones come from young trees, with everything that even looks remotely like a cherry in the mix. I don't know enough about coffee to know if upping the yield (denser planting, less pruning, younger plants, etc) decreases quality as dramatically as it does for wine; but I'm guessing a lot of these Geishas have been pushed into production well before their maturity. In any case, I've been staying away from them this last year.

I still have a supply of very tea-like Colombian geisha that I like best at a very light roast, and pulled on a lever as a lungo single. It's a nice experience, but hardly worth the contortions.
Jim Schulman

Nick Name
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#9: Post by Nick Name »

To make an exception to the rule, I'll have to say that I've once had a 250g bag of Esmeralda's geisha (not the premium lot, but something a little cheaper, but really not that cheap though) from a pro-roaster-friend that he accidentally roasted just a nod too long. He gave it to me and said that it was a mistake, but he'd like to know what I think of it. It was still around medium/medium-light roast and it turned out to make a really good espresso. Not the best espresso I've ever hard, but still something to remember. It honestly was really good, maybe a little bit on the lighter side of an espresso roast, but as a Scandinavian I've had to learn how to pull espressos from a "little bit lighter" roasts.
I remember describing it as one the most sophisticated espressos I had had by that time.

My friend never wanted to roast it that dark again although I asked him to (it was a mistake in the first place, you should never answer you're phone while you're roasting :wink: ) and later on, he has stopped ordering it because of the high price these days.

My personal experiences with geishas and roasting for espresso are nothing to write a song about. Or even a comment on HB. It takes skill - or maybe a lucky accident. :wink:

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Boldjava
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#10: Post by Boldjava »

shawndo wrote:...

So, if you were getting a pound of this coffee, what would you do with it?
espresso, v60? kone vs filter, etc?
Kone. I want every bit of those oils in the cup. Really pay attention to the cup and the changing oils which get presented to you. If anything I note about a Geisha, it is not a homogenized cup. It morphs on you.

RE: Cost. High-priced but when roasting at home, not really a bad cup when compared: cost of cup at home vs often mediocre cups at the shops.
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