I rarely go into cafes here in my home base, but do so quite regularly when traveling. I've been in places where the baristas weren't necessarily warm and fuzzy, but have never experienced or witnessed bad attitude. Having once worked on the bar side two years... four mornings each week from opening time until 8 AM. During that time I did see perhaps a dozen or more instance of BCA (Bad Customer Attitude.) In all but one instance I was able to smooth their ruffled feathers - resulting in a pleasant transaction. On one occasion there was nothing that I or anyone else could do - the customer walked in with a bad attitude and left in the same state.

I do not prompt discussions about how they pull their shots, how old the beans are, what temps they pull at, can they make me a ristretto etc. That being said... my standard order (for me - not when I'm with another person in tow) is one espresso and one machiatto - both "for here" - with the espresso to be served first and followed right after by the machiatto. About three times out of five the barista will instinctively gather that I am a coffee person of sorts - many pleasant coffee related conversations have resulted. Even then - I always keep in mind that they have a job to do and other customers to serve.

My experience at any cafe with a barista (as opposed to most staffed entirely by PBTC) is that there are usually people ringing up the purchases (and getting muffins, bagles, tea, etc) and one or two barista's pulling the shots and making the drinks. The barista's have almost always been friendly and willing to answer questions (as long as it's not busy). The rest of the people are typical hit or miss part time retail help that might be nice or slow or rude or extra helpful.

My guess is that if you're pulling shots for a busy cafe on a Saturday morning you've probably been there for quite awhile and have an investment in the cafe doing well (emotional or otherwise). For example, at the cafe around the corner from me more often then not you'll find the owner there pulling shots when it's busy, and he's probably one of the nicest and most knowledgable guys you could run in to.

The only real issues I've run into are nomenclature. The definition of 'wet' vs 'dry'. What's a 'double cappuccino', hell, what's a 'cappuccino'.

Everyone seems to be comfortable using their own personal definitions, no-one wants to get together and he'p a customer out with a common lexicon, but that doesn't stop them from being all butt-hurt if you use a term familiar to you and resulting in what you expect more often than not, and having them get a different interpretation from it.
They blame you.
And they tend, for the most part, not to do very well in hiding the fact that they blame you. Quite often, they want the room to know that it's your fault, so that they can make sure that the room is aware that they're not stupid and unqualified.
It doesn't happen a lot, as I've leaned towards a description of what I want based on construction rather than suffer the vagaries of 'Buck-speak vs Regional/company/shop-speak and it's subsequent departures form any 'official' interpretations.
And that's met with some lack of enthusiasm from some baristi as well. Either they point at their menu with animation, or are incensed that I'd have the audacity to teach them how to make a drink.
Lately, I've been able to get around it by asking what they'd call a competition-sized cappuccino with both shots in it. And then ordering that.

Caveat: I get annoyed easily. Any of my complaints should be taken with that grain of salt.

I only recall a few bad interactions.

I was getting a ride to work; I needed a caffeine fix. I decided that a mocha from a particular spot would be good; I'd heard they used good syrup (they did). I waited my turn, handed over my travel mug, and asked for a mocha. From this point, I would not have expected a tutorial in how to order a mocha from the shop owner, but I managed to get one. What kind of milk did I want? Skim. Skinny Mocha! and whipped cream? No. Skip the whip!

I certainly didn't need the particular smugness that she delivered the lesson with; nor do I particularly care what your particular shop's (nor any shop's) lingo is. Call it back how you need to; I don't care. I just want my (expletive) drink. I'm not a regular in your shop. As the shop owner, you probably even know this - clues might be that you've never seen me before, and my travel cup has another shop's logo on it. Am I irked? Yes I am.

The barista who called out "skim mocha, no whip" when it was ready seemed to be much more in touch with the situation. My mug even came to me with the post-it still attached, saying skim mocha, no whip. No need for lingo at all, except to help the PBTC taking the order feel superior. (Thanks for asking, I did not have an outburst at that shop on that day.)

Different shop, different day. This place doesn't make the mochas nearly as well (inferior grade syrup), but it's close to the office and still in business (both advantages over the previously mentioned shop), and it's been ... too long since the last coffee. I order; things look promising. I contemplate the advice I had been recently given ("If the person preparing the espresso looks younger than 23, order something with milk"), and newly appreciate the wisdom contained therein. Oh good, my drink is ready. The barely-18 perky girl (who can be perky at this hour? Do you know what time it is, and that most of the people you're dealing with haven't had any coffee yet?) hands my cup back, smiles that perky little smile, and tells me that she drew a cute little heart in it.

Reason kicks in somewhere along here, and I understand at some level that she bears me no malice, and doesn't realize that hearts in my coffee are something I find particularly irritating. Breathe deep, say thanks, go over to the sugar table and stir it into a nice, unoffensive swirl, which quickly fades into an even, creamy brown color.

I'm probably a curmudgeon and a misanthrope; but these two incidents are what I considered "bad attitude". I don't want excessive cheerfulness; I don't want a heart on top*; I don't want to talk in a special code; I don't want an unsolicited lesson. I just want what I ordered, and to go about my day. The shops that focus less on engaging, a little more anonymous get my business. I want to deal with a courteous professional; I don't want to rent a friend.


*I'm willing to make an exception to the heart-on-top rule if the person making the coffee spent the previous night with the person getting the coffee, or if there's a similar level of familiarity. If you don't know my name, please don't put a heart on my coffee.

another_jim wrote:I suspect that the reproach of bad attitude comes into play when the customer makes a request the staff believe is exploitive. Then we, hearing the report, have to decide whether the customer was exploitive or the staff was too rigid.

...

I think you might need to pose this question in a more detailed and specific way.

I think that a lot of the 'BBA' buzz is not about perceived exploitation per se. In '3rd wave' shops there's a lot of misunderstanding about store's quality policies, e.g. no espresso to go, no espresso on ice. A lot of customers perceive barista's refusal to give them what they want, 'awful' as it may be, as pretense.


Credit: totally found this via some barista's Twitter months ago, can't recall whose. Probably Nick Cho's, that would be an amusing coincidence.

It's the classic 'have it your way' vs. 'have it how I say' clash, seems to ruffle a lot of feathers. Just yesterday one of my friends (who is the barista in this case) refused as politely as possible to serve a customer espresso in a to-go cup at a local shop whose policy prohibits doing so. He offered him an alternative, a stout americano or something like that, and the guy ended up threatening to change his yelp review for the place and storming out. He made good on his promise, too, and his review espoused Peet's from Kroger as a viable alternative to the shop. I know what I think of his tastes and attitude. I think espresso in a paper cup is gross and kind of wrong—certainly wasteful and silly. At the end of the day, though, if I think you have no taste and you still want to give me ample monies for something that requires no undue effort on my part... I'd still take your money and avert your anger, whether or not I think it's justifiable. That's definitely not always been my position, and I certainly don't think it's the position of too many '3rd wave' cafes.

My current thinking on whether policies like that are a good idea has developed mostly from discussions I've had with a few shop owners over the last few months. I can see the whole, "I think x is disgusting and wrong and I won't put it on my menu" thing easily. I adore small, simple menus and I think they should as a rule only contain drinks that you're good at... and that you'd recommend. But I increasingly feel like if the request is easily doable and specific, why refuse? It's just going to get you bad PR. It sucks, but that's how it is. On the other hand, granting the request costs you... oh wait, they pay you. For something they know they want, enough to request it specifically. You think it's gross, but you don't have to drink it. And they walk away happy. Not everybody wants a coffee quality epiphany for their $2-5+, and not everybody agrees on what that is.

Anyway, before I keep rambling... I imagine this type of thing is probably the number one cause of customer conflict that results in perceived 'bad barista attitude.' Just my guess.

Thank you for all your comments. They got a thorough discussion this evening in a roundtable of shop owners and other industry folks.

In my own view, there is plenty of room for the "have it your way" and "have it our way" shops to both thrive, at least in urban areas. What is not acceptable anywhere is rudeness, which reached its epitome with the story of one participant (a noted food writer) who was loudly humiliated in one bar for daring to order a decaf.

shadowfax wrote:It's the classic 'have it your way' vs. 'have it how I say' clash, seems to ruffle a lot of feathers.

In a restaurant, I'd prefer the customers at the next table not to be putting ketchup on their lobster, and "have it your way" may well put off guests as well as staff. In a cafe, I'd be less POed by a lack of taste than by very complicated faux taste ahead of me in line, like somebody spending several minutes prescribing the exact proportions of decaf, caf, water, skim, regular, milk and foam; followed by an interrogation to check how organically rainforest it all is.

Sometimes, when that happens I remember to imagine John Cleese as their barista (how would that be for deserved BBA), but mostly I just get steamed.

mitch236 wrote:.... What really ticks me off are the guys who buy one drink and then sit at one of the three available outdoor tables for an entire afternoon! This happens all the time in South Beach on Lincoln road. But even then, without a formal rule about seating times I wouldn't want employees making up their own rules and kicking out the guys. The manager should handle these situations.

I've never been a party to any bad attitude interaction with any barista. My feeling is that most would be embarrassed to even talk about what they've done in any formal way because they're just punching a clock and tamping until it's time to go home. I feel like half of the barista's would rather just push the product and leave it at that, focusing solely on their 'craft'. I'm in agreement with what Jim has mentioned and that is, the customer who complains about bad attitude is usually a customer that has treated the establishment like it's own little b*tch just because of the old mantra 'the customer is always right' and by GOLLY they're going to make sure that's ALWAYS the case when they need to be serviced.

I make conversation with the guys/gals at the third wave shops and they're ALWAYS super nice...so I think the attitude is usually a reflection of your own. NO, that's not ALWAYS the case because baristas are human, but it's usually. However, I digress that I've been a customer service agent in the past and also realize that there are just some of them that attract bad attitude and that's usually because they DESPISE their job and almost every interaction is a reflection of their feelings at all times of the day while working.

I inserted the quote above to bring to light something WAY more disturbing than bad attitude in coffee shops. The loitering wave of the now. I've seen some great establishments get mediocre ratings on sites simply due to the fact that the customer wasn't allowed to just buy a small coffee and pound out the IM chats all day on their laptop/iPad/MacBook whatever. As a customer I'm sick of walking into a shop and not being able to find a place to sit for 10 minutes because of this and far too many shops are giving in and letting customers sit until god only knows how long just because they spent $1.75. Even the shops that have 3 hour time limits will get dinged in ratings! 3 hours?! Go to a library... Do you really need the business that bad that you can afford to let someone sit in your establishment for 3+ hours sipping a tea that's been steeped at least 2 times? This is absurd and I think this needs to be nipped in the butt. Yes, sometimes this happens during down times and, if they take up the 1 out of 3 tables doing that while it's just dead, fine. But, this happening during the rush hour is ludicrous. I've heard all the arguments and don't care for them. A starbucks that is at capacity may have lost business simply due to the fact that someone can't just simply sit down for 5 minutes because half their tables have been taken up by Wifi surfers.

another_jim wrote:In a restaurant, I'd prefer the customers at the next table not to be putting ketchup on their lobster, and "have it your way" may well put off guests as well as staff. In a cafe, I'd be less POed by a lack of taste than by very complicated faux taste ahead of me in line, like somebody spending several minutes prescribing the exact proportions of decaf, caf, water, skim, regular, milk and foam; followed by an interrogation to check how organically rainforest it all is.

+ 1

Customer is King, but Kings can be a very annoying lot for peasants like me.

Marshall wrote:In my own view, there is plenty of room for the "have it your way" and "have it our way" shops to both thrive, at least in urban areas. What is not acceptable anywhere is rudeness, which reached its epitome with the story of one participant (a noted food writer) who was loudly humiliated in one bar for daring to order a decaf.

I agree heartily with both of your comments. My position on "have it your way" vs. "have it our way" is only my opinion (i.e. how I'd be if I took the plunge and started a shop), and I'd be a happy customer of both 'types' assuming their coffee is good.