Hey guys,

Long time lurker here, thanks for having me! After doing a LOT of research out here, I decided to upgrade my past set-up Mokita Super Inox Combi (with built-in grinder) by purchasing a new grinder first. After much thought, I ended up with a refurbished Baratza Vario and I could not be happier. The taste and texture of my espressi have increased tenfolds, and I just can't believe what's coming of my cheap Mokita machine these days.

Still, my current espresso routine involves a Nespresso Aeroccino frother for convenience and time saving in the morning, and I'd now like to change that by getting a machine that can provide adequate steam. I usually have only two milk drinks to build (double mac for me and latte for my lovely girlfriend), but find the steam on the Mokita very (very) weak, and am also annoyed at the additional waiting time brought by the SB design.

I would therefore like to upgrade my machine, but am unsure as to what to get. I'd like to go used if possible, as this would allow me to max the value out of my 1000$ CAD budget. Here are the machines that are currently on the market near me and that I have been considering:

1. A Brugnetti Simona in great shape for 400$.
2. A Reneka Amici (essentially a rebranded Bezzera Galatea Domus, 1 gauge model) for 1000$
3. A Pasquini Livia for 800$.
4. Waiting for something else entirely.

Now, what seems to be the best deal out of these three? The winner on paper seems to be the Amici, but I am unsure whether it worth this sort of price as it is a HX design without a PID and I just missed a deal on a Brewtus II for 750$ last week... Should I just keep waiting?

Like I said, I will be using a Vario and pulling maybe 4 milk drinks a day and one or two straight shots. I would also like the ability to entertain 5-6 drinks at a time when having people over. Finally, I would love a strong, reliable machine that I could have for the next 10 years without much issues. Since I am not the most mechanically inclined either, easy maintenance is also a plus.

Thanks a lot for your help, guys. Much appreciated.
-J

Your budget in combination to your need for an easy to service machine would have me suggesting that you avoid double boiler and PID machines. Their DB machines' innards tend to have more pipes and less space in which to work when service is necessary, and since most PID machines use proprietary parts these have the potential to be more difficult to troubleshoot and more expensive to service.

But for a 10-year machine? I would say that the Vibiemme Domobar Super I had fits the bill. I am not a fan of their cabinets (the case) tends to rattle in use), but the DS was easy to totally disassemble when I had the black frame powder coated before I sold it. Get the stainless model.

I had an Expobar Office Control that made amazing espresso. You can get a good used or refurbished one in your price range. Mine continues providing great espresso at a friend of mines house and it has been going for 12 years with just normal upkeep. I am now a lever nut, so have moved in a different direction. I agree at your price range you should look at an HX and not a double boiler. With a little practice, and Rancilio Silvia would meet your requirements. You could afford a new one. You are limited in quality at your price range. If I were you I would save a bit more and get a Silvano Evo by Quick Mill.

Les

Alaskah0rizon wrote: I will be using a Vario and pulling maybe 4 milk drinks a day and one or two straight shots. I would also like the ability to entertain 5-6 drinks at a time when having people over.

GreatDane wrote:... and Rancilio Silvia would meet your requirements.

After 6½ of owning one (2000-2007), for making multiple drinks in succession, and particularly if milk-based, and if one desires any sort of day-in day-out consistency, I would not recommend a Silvia.

Alaskah0rizon wrote: 1. A Brugnetti Simona in great shape for 400$.
2. A Reneka Amici (essentially a rebranded Bezzera Galatea Domus, 1 gauge model) for 1000$
3. A Pasquini Livia for 800$.
4. Waiting for something else entirely.
-J

You seam to be from mtl so, I would wait for something used hx e61, keep looking for espresso and espresso in your search and be patient. The wait might also provide you with additional savings.
Your choice 1 is a sbdu, limited amount of parts no water outlet, 2: don't know the model, 3: thats the v1 and there are better find for you at that price.

If you know anyone near the Kitchener Waterloo area, or are willing to travel to pick up a machine, this one seems good (Magister Stella):

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-coffee-maker-esp ... nFlag=true

Thanks for the suggestion! Sadly I am in Montreal, so Kitchener is a little too far to go pick up a machine!

I am thinking I should just be patient and wait for the right machine come up on the used market... The Reneka Amici does seem like it could fit the ticket of what I want quite well but I guess I should probably wait for a more well-known and well-tested design to minimize potential disappointments.

Thanks a lot for your answers, you guys are really helpful.

Thanks,
-J

Randy G. wrote:After 6½ of owning one (2000-2007), for making multiple drinks in succession, and particularly if milk-based, and if one desires any sort of day-in day-out consistency, I would not recommend a Silvia.

So Randy what new machine would you recommend in that price range? I had a Silvia for a long time too. I even PIDed one, and learned how unstable it really is! That said $1,000 CAD is a very limited budget for a machine that he wants to last for 10 years with only basic maintenance. Having refurbished several used machines, I think it is a real crap shoot buying a used machine if you aren't willing or able to tear it down and refurbish it if necessary. I bought a used Izzo Alex Duetto that was less than a year old for $750.00. I knew it had been abused. I had to put about $400.00 in parts and many hours of work to refurbish it to get it back to pristine condition. My real recommendation here is to save your money so you can buy a new machine with a warranty.
Les

Les,
I wish I had an answer for the guy. How many times have we seen posts like this. "I only have $xxxx and want a machine that will last fifteen years and make great espresso," or similar? And a great percentage of those don't even consider the cost of a grinder. When those of us with experience try to tell than $xxxx is just not enough we are snobs.

I have, more times than I would care to count, have replied, "Does it HAVE to be espresso, or do you want to make the best coffee possible for the least amount of money?" When the coffee is not a priority I move on to the next thread.

Int his case, I would have said a Gaggia and a good Baratza grinder, but the OP stated that they would want to entertain, and in my opinion, that rules out a SBDU machine. DB machines are out of the price range other than the Breville, but since the OP wants a machine that will last far longer than the Breville has any chance of, it leaves little choice here. An Oscar would not be bad. A used Vibiemme Domobar Super would be cool. Any E-61 HX machine, if one was found in that price range, would be great.

$1000 for a machine that will last 10+ years? With nearly 16 years at this I've learned a bunch of stuff about coffee, and some of that is actually useful. With the OP's requirements I'd like to help. I'd also like to be 15 years younger, 4 inches taller, and find a nice $3000 Porsche Speedster, but my abilities just go so far, and I do what I can with what I have.

Great post Randy. I couldn't agree more. I have been at this for 21 years. I have made 3 great scores in those years a Mazzer Major for $ 50.00 at the Salvation Army, an Expobar Office Control for half price that had been used only 3 times and an Olympia Cremina from an estate that was lightly used for $200.00. There are deals out there and our OP may find one. Chances are one will spend more on junk than finding that great deal. I loved my Major but dropped on the way to an event where I was the barista and totaled it. I had a thousand to spend on a grinder and the best I could do at the time was the Cimbali Max Hybrid. I now have Super Jolly burrs in it. I wish I had saved a little longer and got a Koni like you. So that is my advice to the OP. To be clear, my advice is to limp along with what you have until you have more funds in your budget. Explore this website and learn all that you can, so you can spot a deal if it comes along. See if you can find people in your area with machines you are interested in before buying one of them and try their machines out. I did this. I was in love with the E61 machines, but discovered I just didn't have room for one. I learned this by visiting a friend with a Giotto. Get over the romance and drool factor of so many of the machines out there is important. Make sure a grinder is in your budget as well. There are some good ones out there now for way less than when I bought mine eight years ago. That said, I wouldn't be happy with less than 60mm burrs.

Les