Hoping to hear from anyone with this machine but would welcome anyone's experience with Automatics in general.

I am looking at the VBM DD as my next home machine and have no experience with electronic/Automatic dosage. I have used an ECM Cellini (manual, obviously) for the past 6-7 years, and like the 'Manual experience' but didn't want to dismiss the VBM DD Electronic without some more information.

I prefer straight shots as my morning cup and my question is regarding how much adjustment there is with Electronic dosage? In looking at the top panel photographs at 1st-Line's site I can deduce what look to be Single and Double shot buttons, each with what I guess to be 'Ristretto' and 'Normale' settings. Can you fine tune within those settings or not? Details would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

I believe that the auto dosage of water is a timed event and not volumetric in nature. In any case, you have to decide how important it is for the machine to turn itself off after "X" amount/time of water. Additionally, you must decide how much you would like to spend for that convenience.

Personally, when a choice is to be made, I prefer simplicity. It lends itself to dependability (in theory, at least), and in easier servicing. This is particularly important to me as I try to do all the servicing I can myself.

Can you fine tune within those settings or not? Details would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Yes. The far right button is the programming button and once in that mode, you brew manually for any of the other four buttons you wish to program by starting and stopping the "brew" process with the button you want to program. The number of pulses from the flowmeter is written to memory until you want to change it again.

The manual lever machine would be my choice because of the preinfusion feature and the fact that you can develop a more intimate relationship with the chosen coffee and the brewing process. Yes, the fully automatic machine can be operated in a "manual mode" and yes, the brewing process can be shortened simply by depressing the same button you used for initiation but . . . ya need to try both in a store near you.

Like maybe a short drive to Oregon - http://espressocare.com/

The manual lever machine would be my choice because of the preinfusion feature and the fact that you can develop a more intimate relationship with the chosen coffee and the brewing process.

Manual lever is also my first choice for the reason you state and for mechanical simplicity (or repair...) down the road. My question re. Manual is, with the PID at the brew boiler, what kind of Pre-Cooling Flush can I expect?

Like maybe a short drive to Oregon - http://espressocare.com/

I might consider a visit to Stefano's but it looks like both the Manual and Electronic machines are currently out of stock at any rate.

bubbaD wrote:My question re. Manual is, with the PID at the brew boiler, what kind of Pre-Cooling Flush can I expect?

The E61 group temperature will still change over time, hence the need for a small flush, just enough to bring back the whole group to boiler temp (you don't need a long flush as with HX machines, to flush the HX overheated water). Also, if you read through the buyer's guide for the Domobar Super (http://www.home-barista.com/vibiemme-do...eview.html), the flush should be shorter on the Vibiemme DB than on other E61 DB, as they use a flow restrictor:

The Super has a flow restrictor in the upper thermosyphon line. That keeps the group temperature in check even during extended idle periods. My machines idle group temperature stabilizes at 200F give or take a degree. Even with idle periods in excess of four hours the group never got over 202F according to the thermometer I fitted into the grouphead water path plug bolt.

The required flush should then be pretty short and could be assigned to one of the programmable volumetric buttons of the Electronic version.

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Louis

bubbaD wrote:I might consider a visit to Stefano's but it looks like both the Manual and Electronic machines are currently out of stock at any rate.

Contact him.. He may have some demo units available for your testing/demo purposes.

Having had a volumetric machine in the Solis SL-90, and after a very short while NEVER using it, I can't recommend the extra cost. Additionally, the flow sensor is just one more thing to fail, as mine did. Ditto the electronics which count the pulses.

There has been some chatter about the utility of volumetric dosing being useful to end a shot if the telephone / UPS / FedEx rings, but seriously, are you going to consume a shot that's sat on the tray for a couple of minutes? $300 for the electronics features buys coffee for a very long time at the rate of a scrapped shot every couple of months.

Ian, I couldn't agree more. I guess since I started on a lever (ie a real manual lever like a Pavoni), it never crossed my mind that I could get called away in the middle of making a shot so urgently that I couldn't wait 30 seconds to finish pulling the shot and yet still wanted to drink it after the emergency was over.

There are features I'd consider great to add in that I don't currently have such as plumbing in, but automatic isn't one of them. On the grinder, however, where split seconds matter more and the eye is not the best tool to decide when to stop, I consider a timer a great plus (although I still like to weigh my coffee anyway).