hi. i'm new here. i'm finally upgrading to a marzocco gs3 (i don't deserve it). it's a big expense. while i'd ideally like a mazzer or something to go with it, fiscal prudence suggests i hold onto my doserless rocky for at least a while. however, i'm curious though, is this completely crazy? is this grinder completely inadequate given the machine? it worked terrifically with my e61 hx for years.

thanks in advance for opinions.

-sam

Welcome to the HB forums!

To be brief and blunt: Yes, the Rocky is inadequate to realize all of the potential benefit of your machine upgrade, assuming that your coffee and skills are sufficient.

If you are on a budget, I would suggest a Pharos. Titan quality at a Rocky pricepoint.

The Rocky will suffice as you save for something better.


-Mike

samster wrote:hi. i'm new here. i'm finally upgrading to a marzocco gs3 ...

Welcome. This forum is less for expert consumers, prosumers or whatever; and more for coffee lovers and hobbyists. You'll learn the difference quickly, I'm sure.

samster wrote:hi. i'm new here. i'm finally upgrading to a marzocco gs3 (i don't deserve it). it's a big expense. while i'd ideally like a mazzer or something to go with it, fiscal prudence suggests i hold onto my doserless rocky for at least a while. however, i'm curious though, is this completely crazy? is this grinder completely inadequate given the machine? it worked terrifically with my e61 hx for years.

If I suddenly had the upgrade budget for a GS3 and already had a nice hx machine with a doserless rocky, I'd do this upgrade in the other order. Meaning I'd carve out a fifth of what I'd allocated to the GS3 and get a great grinder right now to use with my hx, then wait until I'd replenished my budget to get the GS3. I've never used a GS3, but I'd expect that the improvement in the cup moving from a Rocky to any of the $1200-ish grinders with an E61 HX machine would be much greater than the improvement in the cup moving from an E61 HX machine to the GS3 with a Rocky.

What makes you want to upgrade the machine first?

I'm not too familiar with the Rocky, but from what I've read, it goes through burrs quicker than other grinders. If you haven't replaced the burrs in a while, that might be a cheap way to improve your grind quality. It will also help the resale value when it comes time to upgrade to a more appropriate grinder. I'd look at the new Virtuoso Preciso as well, it's less the $300 iirc which may (or may not) fit into your budget. It compares favorably to the Baratza Vario which is, anecdotally the same grind quality of a Mazzer.

cheers,

PS - don't mind Jim, he gets cranky with his old age.

Many people fall into the trap of machine lust. Thinking the uber machine will get the best out of the bean. I certainly fit that profile. Many years ago I bought a Linea (the GS-3 of its time) and a Mazzer Mini. For years I was disappointed with my espresso to the point of storing my machine in the garage! Then I decided to get back involved and came to this forum. Jammin was the first to point out my weak grinder. Then AndyS again. I decided to go all out and got a Robur. I can say with no reservations that the grinder was the biggest bang for my buck. Consider the sage advice and upgrade your grinder first then the machine. Your palate will thank you!

geoffbeier wrote:If I suddenly had the upgrade budget for a GS3 and already had a nice hx machine with a doserless rocky, I'd do this upgrade in the other order.

+1

I upgraded my Rocky to a Super Jolly (and kept the E61) and it made a significant difference after a short period of learning.

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

geoffbeier wrote:If I suddenly had the upgrade budget for a GS3 and already had a nice hx machine with a doserless rocky, I'd do this upgrade in the other order. [snipped] What makes you want to upgrade the machine first?

Started with the standard Silvia, then moved to e61 HX with the Rocky. But the HX died suddenly and has already been repaired a number of times --- and has died again. It's a long story riddled with frustration.

Bottom line is that this purchase is less about good judgement and more about a buying opportunity. Frankly, the next machine down that I was thinking about was the Vivaldi mini, but the price gap between is big. Much rather have the GS3, but that rather depletes the account. And I don't want to buy the machine yet again 3 years down the line (just do it as the nike commercial goes.)

Maybe I will get a home equity loan and apply towards a MiniE.

samster wrote:hi. i'm new here. i'm finally upgrading to a marzocco gs3 (i don't deserve it). it's a big expense. while i'd ideally like a mazzer or something to go with it, fiscal prudence suggests i hold onto my doserless rocky for at least a while. however, i'm curious though, is this completely crazy? is this grinder completely inadequate given the machine? it worked terrifically with my e61 hx for years.

To over-simplify things: The grinder makes the flavours/aromas from the roasted beans available. The espresso machine pushes hot water through the grounded coffee to transfer them to water.

A better espresso machine will allow you to improve / add consistency in this latter step. Hence, a GS/3 paired with a basic grinder should consistently provide you with a basic espresso cup quality.

Doing the reverse, upgrading your grinder (for example to a Baratza Vario, found to provide a comparable grind quality to Titan grinder, while not being built as one; or straight to a Titan league grinder) and keeping your current espresso machine would usually, but may be not consistently, provide you with a better cup quality.

Keep in mind that an E61 HX is already good equipment (even if I don't know the exact model you have). Upgrading to a GS/3 will buy you functionality and convenience but could be found to provide only a slight improvement in cup quality.

Also, the grinder and espresso machine can only express what was in the bean originally. Good roasted beans, along with good technique, are probably more important than the espresso machine, especially if you already own an E61 HX.

samster wrote:however, i'm curious though, is this completely crazy?

I dare not giving you a direct answer... ;o)

samster wrote:But the HX died suddenly and has already been repaired a number of times --- and has died again. It's a long story riddled with frustration.

I can't imagine any way, then, that the Rocky + GS3 combo is some kind of step backwards vs the Rocky + E61 combo.