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UPDATE SEE PAGE 2
I just wanted to introduce myself.

In 2005 I moved to Miami and I was introduced to this thing called colada (cuban espresso).

It was so good, that I went for seconds... a couple of hours later my left eye-lid was twitching, I though it was the pressure from my new job... but nope.... it was the cuban coffee.

Ever since I have been hooked!

In 2008 as the economy crumbled, I left Miami and I have been stuck in this place called Delaware with no good espressos for a long time . In 2012 I found a guy at a local coffee shop that did some good espressos... I believe he worked as a barista for a few years in Italy but he quit a couple of months ago and the new gal sucks really bad.

I don't understand, it's the same machine, the same coffee... but it tastes substantially different. Now, I find myself ordering a cappuccino hoping the frothed milk will disguise the bad espresso.

Now, maybe it's because I have been deprived of a good espresso for over 5 years, but I find my two Nespresso machines (one at home and one at the office) to be fairly decent. I mean, they do better espressos than my local store for sure.

I guess, this is why I'm here... I want to take it to the next level and I have been thinking on getting an starter machine like the gaggia classic. not sure about the grinder yet.

Anyway, I can see there is plenty of good resources here, so I will just get going and start reading.

Ohh, just one question... I was looking on craiglist to see if I can get a good deal but couldn't find a gaggia classic. There were a couple of other gaggias: "Unica" Super Automatic($200), "Titanium" Super-Automatic($400), and a "Pure" semi-Automatica ($85). but I was not sure how they compare to the classic.

Thanks a lot for your help

I'll cover the grinder is more important than the machine! I looked at a Gaggia classic as a good intro machine for the price. At the moment I love my Lever machines to much to make the switch but many others here can comment on a semi auto.

No matter what you get , search around here on the grinder forum. The grind makes a world of difference. Lots of electrics to choose from and I hear the Orphan Espresso Lido 2 is coming out shortly (hand grinder).

Good luck.

Avoid the superautos. Avoid many of the low end machines.

Start by defining a budget for a grinder AND machine. You need both. An espresso machine won't work without a grinder. If I were starting over I would start by trying to find a used Mazzer SJ or Baratza Vario, and I'd buy the best machine I could afford with the rest of the budget. If you don't mind hand grinding, the OE Pharos is the best value around, and there's not a better grind in existence.

We can also help more if you tell us the space you have to work with for a setup, how much you make at any given time, and what you drink on the regular.

Typical Cuban stlye coffee/espresso common in Miami is often made with a $#!t ton of sugar. And it's no third wave fare going into the groups. It's dark roasted, heavily bodied dreck that probably wouldn't be palatable at a lighter roast.

forbeskm wrote:I'll cover the grinder is more important than the machine! I looked at a Gaggia classic as a good intro machine for the price. At the moment I love my Lever machines to much to make the switch but many others here can comment on a semi auto.

No matter what you get , search around here on the grinder forum. The grind makes a world of difference. Lots of electrics to choose from and I hear the Orphan Espresso Lido 2 is coming out shortly (hand grinder).

Good luck.

Thanks!
I wouldn't mind a manual machine either. I was looking at a caravel, but sounded like a lot of trouble to bring one from Italy. what do you have?

pacificmanitou wrote:Avoid the superautos. Avoid many of the low end machines.

Start by defining a budget for a grinder AND machine. You need both. An espresso machine won't work without a grinder. If I were starting over I would start by trying to find a used Mazzer SJ or Baratza Vario, and I'd buy the best machine I could afford with the rest of the budget. If you don't mind hand grinding, the OE Pharos is the best value around, and there's not a better grind in existence.

I don't have a set budget... but I can tell you from experience that I feel more conformable buying things little by little and upgrading them as I go than spending a lot money all at once. Even if I end up spending more the other way around.

If I have learned something from reading this forum so far is that the grinder makes the difference. Just looking at Baratza they have grinders from $120 to $900 is there a big difference between encore and vario?

pacificmanitou wrote: We can also help more if you tell us the space you have to work with for a setup, how much you make at any given time, and what you drink on the regular.

My kitchen is fairly big, but my wife already commented that my real state would be limited As soon as I buy another machine, she is going to ask to put away the Nespresso machine. I drink one espresso in the morning before I go to work. My wife sometimes drink one too. That's pretty much it (1-2 per day). If I could make a cappuccino I would probably alternate between the two.

TomC wrote:Typical Cuban stlye coffee/espresso common in Miami is often made with a $#!t ton of sugar.

Yeah, from what I remember seeing the lady in Miami would pour a little bit of coffee and immediately add as much sugar as coffee.... then, she would pour the rest of the espresso on the cup

TomC wrote: And it's no third wave fare going into the groups. It's dark roasted, heavily bodied dreck that probably wouldn't be palatable at a lighter roast.

I'm gonna have to read some more before I figure out what you are telling me...

BTW, I'm open to try more than just cuban espressos.

I have La Pavoni's, a 73, 74, 2010, 76, 78, and La Grazielle/La Cara. Yes I have a problem

Pavoni's are a finicky bunch but I love the espresso I can make with them. 73 is my favorite no pressurestats, just a spring and a relief valve. I got it for 200 something on ebay . I got the base custom powder coated. Just an fyi, most ebay deals will need all new gaskets but usually thats it.

Is it a great machine for all, no. It took a while to dial it in with a good grinder. Now it pulls consistent shots. Usually 4 a day but sometimes up to 6. They over heat if left on or you pull to many shots. It will burn you, just a matter of when , damn thing gets hot! Steaming milk, hmm challenging is the word, I use a single tip and a frother to keep the whirlpool.

Lots of lever stuff in the lever forum. I can only speak for the Pavoni, for the price 200-900 it makes some damn fine espresso. Chince on the grinder and your Pavoni will hate you.

Caravels are no harder to import than any other machine. I've imported five home levers and a grinder. Go buy one on e-bay Italy. Google translate is your friend if you don't speak the language. Caravels hold their value best, and la peppinas are getting there. Used to be they were plentiful and cheap, my first one was $147 with shipping to US. If you like the caravel, Jorge (beerandmathematics) has a boni little on the exchange now. Its one of the final caravel models, with a very different aesthetic, but quite similar design to the classic.

You also can't go wrong with a pavoni, but the learning curve is steep.

For any machine you need a good grinder. As mentioned, OE Pharos is unbeatable, and the lido II looks absolutely incredible. I also stand by a Mazzer SJ recommendation. There are enough out there that they price competitively with a Baratza vario, and work better for espresso than a vario will, IMO.

Still, a vario is a great option, and the only Baratza I would recommend for espresso.

With regard to which used Gaggia to purchase I would go with the Gaggia Classic. Out of all of the entry level Gaggia's it's the best built. I would stay away from the other super auto models. They can produce a satisfactory shot but with the Classic + a good grinder you can dial in your coffee exactly the way you like it. You can also get a PID for the Classic as well to fine tune temp. As for The Baratza grinders there are big differences. The most obvious is the number of settings Encore compared to Vario. The more settings to fine tune your espresso the better it will taste. Although I have been able to dial in the Encore for espresso it's very limited. I would recommend the Preciso or higher in the Baratza line. If your looking for a deal Baratza sells refurb grinders on their site.

I'm using the Gaggia Classic. You can definitely pull good shots from it. I found a decent price for a new one on Whole Latte Love. The Gaggia Users Group has lots of good tips for getting the best out of this machine.

As for the grinder? Others here are more knowledgeable than I am. Take their advice...within reason.

You're going to want good coffee. Check out the threads here about our favorite roasters and blends. Right now I'm enjoying Metropolis Redline. You're going to love this so much more than the pod systems.

The single most important thing, though, is learning and practice. Check out the great instructional videos right on this site. As with any form of cooking, there's going to be a period where you are learning how to use your tools and materials. You're not going to be able to "buy" a good shot of espresso by buying expensive equipment.

Enjoy the journey!

To the OP, if you spend too little you'll get a machine that's harder to use and your learning will take longer. There are threads in the FAQs and Favorites of this Buying Advice forum that give you guidance on machines for your budget. They're well worth the read. If you buy something that's not quite good enough it will be discouraging and will cost more in the end.

Off topic for a moment ...

TomC wrote:Typical Cuban stlye coffee/espresso common in Miami is often made with a $#!t ton of sugar. And it's no third wave fare going into the groups. It's dark roasted, heavily bodied dreck that probably wouldn't be palatable at a lighter roast.

I know Tom's talking about a typical heavily dark roasted coffee, maybe with Robusta in it and possibly brewed too hot so it's bitter. But I don't want the OP to be discouraged and overgeneralize about dark roasts. If you like drinking capps a darker roast can make it taste like there's as much chocolate in the cup as there is coffee. It's one of the styles I like. The trick is to pull it much cooler than a third wave lighter roast. Some espressos are also roasted so that adding a little sugar eliminates bitterness and adds fruitiness. Some of the Mr. Espresso coffees are like that and I know for sure they do this on purpose. I think of this more like different styles of cooking and some are done well, others not. There are badly roasted coffees and inferior beans whether dark or lighter roasted.