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Pitfalls to avoid on eBay

Postby Sketcher on Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:02 pm

Just a word of warning on ebay purchases. I bought a used Aristarco EMA 75 grinder about 10 days ago. I thought I'd treat it to some new paint and fresh burrs eventually, but this is how it arrived:

I assembled the hopper to give a few clues:
Image
It seems that somewhere down the line, the grinder has been dropped. Whether it was like that before shipping or it happened during, I can't say. Here, it can be seen that the grind adjustment and underlying mechanisms suffered the most direct, completely ruinous damage:
Left side of grinder (nice gapping, is that for extra motor cooling?):
Image
Right side of grinder (not nearly as breezy):
Image

It's not only the adjustment collar, the whole mechanical assembly was knocked out of alignment with the frame, so much so that there is a gap between the two:
Left Side (Loose fit would be an understatement):
Image
Right Side (nice and snug):
Image

On further inspection, the doser is out of round as well, the lid might fit on the oval eventually, with some strict maneuvering, but it's not exactly a nice fit:
Image

So the short and long of it is the grinder alignment is totally questionable, as evidenced by the first crop of photos. I've so far put up the purchase price, shipping and duty to get it to Canada. Even with Ebay and Paypal's purchase protection, I stand to only recoup the shipping and purchase price (not duty) and I will probably end up spending another $60 getting it back to the original owner.

So the long and short of it is, good luck out there. I've had great luck buying about 10 items on ebay so far but once in a while, everyone gets a bad deal. Honestly it's a bad deal for both me and the vendor but there's definitely an inherent risk in going the Ebay route...
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Postby Bob_McBob on Thu Jan 20, 2011 5:10 pm

Do you have any photos from the eBay listing? Was there any corresponding damage to the packaging? You can apply to the CBSA for a refund on the sales tax you paid if you return the grinder. There shouldn't have been any duty.

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Postby duke-one on Thu Jan 20, 2011 6:07 pm

My son bought a used truck on EBay; it was supposed to be a "daily driver". Broke down twice on the trip from South Cal back to the Bay Area. He had it trucked back to the seller and got most of his $ back but still lost a handfull. My point is that it is better, often, to lose some money and get the damm thing out of your life then to live with your mistake.
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Postby nixter on Thu Jan 20, 2011 6:08 pm

I don't think you should have paid duty either. Border brokerage fees are another story.
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Postby Sketcher on Thu Jan 20, 2011 6:38 pm

Thank you all for the replies. I definitely appreciate all the replies. I did pay tax at least, for which I might try to recoup costs (again, many thanks), but I used the term "duty" relatively loosely, it was in fact a brokerage fee from the evil UPS (they seem to always charge an arm and a leg). Actually the original ebay photo isn't very helpful, it's only one photo and from a good distance with low resolution.

Ebay/PayPal (same ownership) have a buyer protection policy which I believe I apply for. Regardless of when the package was damaged (whether in shipment or prior) isn't relevant, just whether it was damaged or not (i.e. "Not as Described"). The protection goes up to the original shipping and purchase cost, but does put the onus on the buyer to ship the item back (which I'm planning to do in the allotted time) and of course pay the fees for the return shipping. One way or another, I'll lose money on this little misadventure but I think it's a reality of doing business on ebay and across the border. Honestly, I've had very good luck before with my espresso machine and a number of small electronic devices and power tools but I guess it was just my time...

Again, thank you all for the advice, especially regarding the duty/tax return information, I didn't think it would be worth my time but I think I'll try to at least get the GST paid back...
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Postby Sketcher on Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:01 am

So the plot thickens... The seller has denied my request for a refund. They claim (not to say it's not true) that the grinder was broken during shipping. The box, though, looks to be in relatively good shape:

Image
Image

The grinder, when I received it, was packed transversely so the damaged adjustment collar was sitting along the big pictured faces. No signs of damage on the box...

The claim process is pretty slow but essentially, ebay protects buyers for both the shipping cost and purchase price. If I were to try and pursuade UPS that they broke it, I only stand a chance of getting the insured value back (i.e. purchase price). However, I need to ship the item back to the seller today as to not violate their 3-day return policy. In my case, unless the claim gets approved, I'll be out the shipping cost to get it here, the shipping cost to get it back, the purchase price and brokerage fees I paid (again, to the evil UPS).

Honestly I can't prove what happened to this grinder and when it happened, all I know, as a buyer, is that it happened before it arrived at my doorstep, and I'm not in a position to be able to lay blame correctly in this case (to either the seller or buyer or both), and expecting that of a buyer who hasn't seen the item before (except for a grainy ebay photo) might be a bit unfair. If I ever sell on ebay, I'll be sure to take lots of high-quality photos before shipping off a high-value item to a seller though...

Ebay is great for those of us that don't have a good selection of stuff on craigslist to choose from but as a first time claimant, I have to say the dispute process is tough if you don't have an understanding seller...
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Postby lsjms on Fri Jan 21, 2011 11:39 am

Bad luck mate.

On a hit hard enough to do that damage, I think there should be a clear mark on the inside of the box, the corrugations should be crushed flat.

Have you considered just hitting it again? Might pop back!
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Postby Randy G. on Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:00 pm

I have not read the FedEx shipping insurance details, but it is the sender's responsibility to pack the merchandise so that it ships safely. The original packing was not used, so right off they assume a responsible position. The box looks fairly undamaged (no tire tracks, etc.) so by default either the sender shipped a damaged product or the item was improperly protected considering its mass. Something this heavy should be double-boxed.
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Postby dialydose on Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:10 pm

I am still curious about what was shown on the initial listing for this grinder. Quite honestly, if they would have shown a picture similar to your first picture (even with a straight hopper) I would not have paid more than $100 for that grinder, probably less. That grinder has obviously seen a lot of use and not much care. Ebay's "protection" mechanisms are a joke and largely useless.
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Postby Sketcher on Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:52 pm

The original packaging was just styrofoam peanuts, which could really have been an issue... they can shift out of the way during shipping and provide no protection at all. In the ebay post, the low-resolution photo appears to show a straight hopper but you never know if the hopper was just placed loosely, the photo was taken or if the grinder suffered subsequent damage during packing or handling or it was the shipper that damaged the item... We'll see. I know the machine was heavily used but for a 64 mm grinder with 300W+ motor from a tight budget, it would have been an okay starting point...
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