I have been reading coffee forums for weeks and I have gained some knowledge but, I don't think I am any closer to a decision than when I started.

I have spoken with several of the companies that are mentioned here. I have a long list of machines that have been suggested to me. I could use some opinions to help narrow down the list.

I am the only person in my house that drinks coffee. We do not entertain very often, and when we do I serve drip or french press. I do not want to make espresso for a crowd. I usually drink about 2 caps or lattes a day. I would like to purchase a machine that will last for a long time. I do not want to upgrade in the future. My current machine is an old Krups pump. I'm sure anything will be an improvement, but I only want to do this once.

I'm looking at buying a macap m4 or mazzer mini grinder.

Here is the list

La Pavoni Lever - I think a manual may have less parts to fail. I'm not sure about the learning curve. Getting too hot does not concern me because I only drink a double. I have read that some people think the taste is great and others prefer a pump machine.

Alexia - This was suggested to me because of my limited use.
Anita
Andreja - This is starting to get a little pricey for me.

Elektra Micro Casa A Leva - Too tall for my cabinets

Vivaldi - Price is making me squirm

Ponte Vecchio

Bezzera

Fiorenzato Bricoletta

Vibiemme Domobar

I would appreciate any information, experience or opinions. Thanks

Tink/Heidi, I currently have a Gaggia Factory 16 cup (a "clone" of the La Pavoni Pro which is no longer manufactured [the Gaggia that is! ]) and am very happy with it (you can search on my posts and find a detailed, some might say overly detailed, description of my trip down the espresso path which ended in the Gaggia!). Good machine with a bit of a learning curve (but, in my case, not that steep!). Also an Alexia would be a good choice (with the PID you'd almost eliminate the temperature "surfing"). VBM Domobar Super seems to be a GREAT machine, very stable and made with commercial grade components, Vivaldi is one that I almost purchased, but I have "space constraints" that prevented that. Pretty much ANY of the machines you mention would make excellent, long term systems. EACH is going to have items that need to be repaired/replaced over time, NONE of them should be a "fixer-upper" (require excessive maintenance), but each will have different (and some of the same) system maintenance and repair. The La Pavoni (europiccola or Pro) is the simplest and can EASILY last, with care, for 30-40 years if you want... La Pavoni has been making the system, with limited changes over the years, for 40-50 years now.. BUT, while I have found the system to be easy (for me) some have found it much harder to "climb the learning curve". Alexia, Anita, etc are great machines that make great espresso, Vivaldi, VBM, etc also are great machines .... etc.

There are LOTS of threads on this site (and others) that cover what you're looking for. The search function is your friend! .

ALL depends on your budget, space available and your willingness to learn the process. NOT hard, but there will be some bumps in the road as you learn. The more you know, the more "demanding" you will become, but that's the way things go!

Best I can say, is enjoy the trip!

Round numbers for the sake of discussion:

Pavoni Europiccola #EPC-8 approx $750 (#EPC-16 approx $950)
Alexia $950

If the situation is as you say (only you will be drinking; two drinks per day; no entertaining), I'd opt for a single-boiler/dual-use machine like the Alexia. While it is true that the Pavoni has fewer mechanical parts, and thus less likely to break, searching for info on the Alexia will show you that it is a solid, reliable machine. Lever machines are much more finicky about grind and tamping (my personal experience with a Pavoni for 5+ years), than a manual pump machine like the Alexia.

That said, if you truly want a lever, you might look at the Ponte Vecchio Lusso 1-Group ($900-1100); the level is spring-loaded, and the pull(s) tend to be more consistent (i.e.: you may find the "learning curve" to be less steep).

That said, the only machine I have personally used is the Pavoni. But there are plenty of people here with personal experience on the PV or the Alexia who, I am sure, will chime in.

Cheers,
Jason

Heidi,

This is a perfect example of what I meant: Steve wrote, "BUT, while I have found the [Pavoni] system to be easy (for me) some have found it much harder to 'climb the learning curve'."

ANY well-built machine will last for a long time, but I found that, in 5+ years, I was never able to produce a great shot with my La Pavoni (good, yes; very good; yes; great, no), and ended up giving it to a friend. So, for me, the learning curve was steeper on the Pavoni than, say, the "temperature surfing" learning curve of an HX machine.

Also, perhaps most importantly, don't forget the grinder! You mention the Macap 4 or Mazzer Mini -- both good choices. I have no doubt that part of my problem with the Pavoni was my lack of a quality grinder at the time.

The bottom line, Heidi, is that each of these machines is a solid, well-made machine that will suit your needs. You get the one that strikes the loudest chord within you, that you like the looks of and can live with the longest. Clearly the Pavoni will, for example, take up the least amount of counter space, plus you can easily move it off the counter if you need the space for cooking that dinner for 12!

Enjoy!

Cheers,
Jason

Personally, I would strongly recommend against the QuickMill Alexia if you are primarily making milk-based drinks (cappuccinos & lattés). Since it is a dual-purpose single boiler, I think you will find it extremely frustrating to wait in between changing modes. Alexia is ideal for the "purist" that only drinks espresso, IMO, but not so much for latté drinkers like yourself (and me, actually).

The La Pavoni is an interesting choice. I happen to have one, and they are a good bit of fun. They work at their best making 1 or 2 drinks at a session (and then you turn the machine off and refill the boiler). The issue with a La Pavoni is that it's very hands on, all the time. Everything (other than maintenance, which is child's play compared to most other machines) is more of a pain. The drip tray can fill up multiple times in a session, it's hard to find any part of the machine to touch that isn't scalding hot (pretty much only the black handles/knobs), and the espresso is often a little bit finicky. You can definitely make good and great espresso on it, but consistency is significantly more difficult than just about anything else on your list. I would recommend the La Pavoni as an eBay purchase (got my Professional for $200 in near-mint condition). I feel that ~$800 is way too much to pay for the pain that the La Pavoni can be.

I appreciate your concern for build quaility. I think it's an extremely important consideration when you are thinking about spending as much money as you are. Based on your desire for quality, and your habit of mainly making milk-based drinks, I would personally recommend the Vibiemme Domobar Super (the black manual--electronic is a mistake, it's one more piece of hardware to go wrong that is EXTREMELY expensive to replace). I was looking at pictures of the insides of the Vibiemme (found here), and I am thoroughly impressed. It starts to look like a real commercial machine on the inside. Extremely high-quality parts and construction. The only downside to me is the vibratory pump. I think you would like it a lot though--it's very temperature stable, so it's easier to get more consistent temperatures in your pulls, and the fact that it has a thermosyphon restrictor means that it will be more ideal for your light use. It also has a massive boiler compared to any of the machines you are looking at getting, so it will end up being able to steam milk perfectly once you learn to use it. Even a flow-restricted "easy" tip will probably work fairly fast on it.

That's just something to think about. I almost wish I had gotten a Vibiemme myself, but I really wanted a rotary pump (quiet, I think more reliable) and an easy plumb-in to the water supply, so I bought Vetrano. He's a very cool machine too. Good luck making your decision.

I've had the Quick Mill Alexia with optional PID installed for just a bit under two weeks. I can certainly vouch for the fact she is extremely easy to use and ramp up with. I had never made espresso before, and with a bit of instruction and very little trial and error, I've been able to make pretty good espresso and steam milk well enough to make decent cappas and macchiatos.

With that being said, Alexia was perfect for me....for about five days. My initial situation was me, an espresso-only drinker, and my wife, a one cappa per day drinker. Alexia worked just fine for this, and the 60-second wait for steam once per morning was just no big deal. She steams milk well!

However, my 17-year-old son has, after having one or two of the drinks I made, decided he likes espresso now and has taken to making himself a latté every morning. My 19-year-old daughter (trained to steam milk by two years at Starbucks) does the same thing when she's home from college (just across Lake Washington). As a result, I wish I would've gone with Anita and her ability to steam and pull shots simultaneously. In fact, if I had it to do all over again, I would probably have gone with the Vibiemme Domobar Super (extremely well-built) or the Izzo Alex and its rotary pump (not that Alexia is too loud...she's actually pretty quiet....but it would be nice to have the plumb-in option for the future).

I do want to impress upon you that if you know you'll only be making one drink at a time and you will never have to whip up three or four milk drinks in a row on a semi-regular basis, Alexia is a beautiful solution. She's stable, easy to use and very repeatable. If you're going to make more than one milk drink at a time, though, I'd make the move (I'd call it a lateral move, rather than an upgrade...the machines just function differently) to an HX.

NOTE: I personally would not make the move to an HX right now. If I ever do "upgrade"...it would be to the dual-boiler Vibiemme or something similar that may be available in the future. I just couldn't bring myself to go to flushing and/or water dancing after the incredible ease of Alexia. However, I think starting out HX would've been just fine.

P.S. It looks like you've got the grinder covered!

P.S.S. Congratulations to the Jayhawks!

Thanks everyone for all of the information.

Maybe I should have broken the list down into price ranges.

Sub $1000
La Pavoni
Ponte Vecchio
Bezzera
Alexia

$1200
Briccoletta
Anita

$1500
Domobar
Andreja
Izzo Alex

$1900
Vivaldi
Vibiemme Domobar Super

I'm not sure where to land in the price scale. Where is the value point? Price vs quality? Any machines that I should add or subtract from the list?

Any thoughts?

Thanks

I would add the Izzo Alex to the $1,500 category and the new Vibiemme DoubleDomo to the $1,900 category.

While I've only handled all the Quick Mill machines, the others you've selected all seem to be of good quality and have their followers. My only thought to add would be that if you feel a single boiler/dual-use machine won't work and you must go to an HX, for your limited use I'd opine the machines in the $1,200 - 1,300 range would be awfully hard to beat for value. But please temper that thought with the knoweldge I'm a huge fan of pre-infusion and its forgiving nature. It's not a knock on the lever machines or the Bezzera. But if you want to spend more money, the machines and their components only get better (and more reliable) from there.

I think only you can decide on price range.

I think that in the sub-$1000 range, you are looking at a set of machines that forego a lot of conveniences. A lever you have to pull the shot yourself, and the temperature control is more challenging. They will likely be less consistent, and require more skill and attention on your part.

The $1200 range machines are the "HX upgrade" bottom line. Those are the cheapest machines that you can get with the convenience of the heat exchanger, i.e., no waiting for steam. The problem that you are going to run into with machines like this is that their groupheads are not very well tuned, so they will often require very large flush before the shot, after sitting idle. But the main difference is that they will likely be high maintenance vs. more expensive machines. Machines at this level usually have cheaper fittings on the steam valves, use lower-grade over-pressure valves, cheaper pumps, cheaper pressurestats, etc. Basically, with the $1200 machines, the workmanship and the quality of the components is somewhat lower than the $1500 range of machines.

Your $1900 Vivaldi is the only 2-boiler machine on the list. Double boiler machines cost a lot more for the obvious reason that they have a good bit more going on inside (2 boilers and the plumbing and wiring to manage them). They are generally a lot easier to get stable shot to shot temperatures, and require less or no flushing compared to the heat exchanger machines. I think with your budget such a machine is out of the question--unless this really appeals to you to have easy temperature management. It's worth noting that the temperature profile on a double boiler machine will be wholly different from an E61 HX machine. I am not sure that this will make any difference to you (I certainly don't think I would care either way), but it's worth noting.

I think that one thing worth mentioning is this--there is not a lot of difference between $1000 and $1500 for an espresso machine, IMO. You are talking about buying the last machine you will ever own. I think that, for that, you should consider trying to get something that's pretty convenient, but above all get something with either simple design (like a Ponte Vecchio, Elektra, or Pavoni) or something with extremely high quality components. Really, they all do pretty well. I think you would have pretty good chances of having a trouble-free life with Bricoletta or Anita. I think if you are considering Andreja, you would probably categorically be happier with the Vibiemme, though. The only advantage that I can see with Andreja is the no-burn steam arm and an insulated boiler, and that's a lot to pay for when sacrificing a commercial pressurestat and a massive boiler.

Alas, I ramble...

Heidi,

Through his ramblings, Nicholas makes some very valid points.

If you are not drinking straight espresso, but need to steam milk for even two (maybe three) cappuccinos or lattes per day, the "single boiler/dual use" machine can get tiresome. It depends upon your own personality and patience. But the more I think about it, if you do go that route, you may be just as well served by a Rancilio Silvia or Gaggia Classic as you would a Quick Mill Alexia, and save some money to boot!

"Temperature surfing" has the reputation of being difficult, but it isn't. Most people on this site have HX machines, and it's one of those things that is more difficult to describe than to do -- thus, when one reads about it, it seems complicated. It's not.

If you're serious about never having to upgrade (famous last words), I'd look at the following machines off your second list, listed alphabetically: Izzo Alex (HX), La Spaziale Vivaldi II (DB), Vibiemme Domobar Super (HX), Vibiemme DoubleDomobar Super (DB).

Each has an advantage. The Alex is one of the few "easily convertible" machines. That is, it can be a pour-over machine OR a plumbed-in, with the simple turn of a valve. You may think now that you don't want/need a plumbed-in model, but it's nice to have the flexibility! Plus, it has a rotary pump, and is thus quieter than a vibe model. The Vibiemme HX model is a solid, well-made, and very reliable machine. The two D(ual) B(oiler) machines have the advantage of two boilers and thus added temperature stability; the Vivaldi is also volumetrically dosed, as opposed to the Vibiemme DB model, but the Vivaldi MUST be plumbed in (unless you get the "Mini-Vivaldi") while the Vibiemme does not -- depending upon the model you select. Also, the Vivaldi really needs a 20 amp plug, which may or may not be a problem, depending upon where you set up your machine.

* * * * *

Side note: As you know from my previous posts, I'm not the biggest fan of lever models; that's my own bias -- don't let it affect you. Many people here love levers, and I confess I am still "intrigued" by them . . . now that I know enough to realize my own errors are largely responsible for my bias. That said, both La Pavoni Europiccola models and Elektra Micro Casa a Leva models have been known to last seemingly forever. Keep in mind their biggest drawbacks (as far as I'm concerned) is that a) you cannot add water to the boiler if it is running low unless either the machine is cold, or unless you bleed off all the pressure (unlike tank or plumbed-in models); and b) they will run hot after a couple of shots (less of an issue if you are the only espresso/cappuccino drinking in the house).

* * * * *

Finally, there will always be one more piece of information to collect, one more new machine coming out soon that you could possible wait for. Trying to collect every tidbit of information will drive you crazy, and waiting for the next model will prevent you for ever taking the plunge. Trust me: we have all been on information overload at some point in our own buying process(es) of finding the right machine.

Again, each of these machines is a worthwhile choice, and you'll be happy with it for years to come!
That's why at some point you just have to take the information you have, check your gut (logically what suits your needs), check your heart (aesthetically, what looks the best -- you're going to have to live with it in your home), and go for it -- make the decision, don't look back, and enjoy the best cappuccino you're ever made!

Cheers,
Jason