I have had the Expobar Brewtus II since Oct 2007.
I have had to replace internal parts several times.

I am concerned that is it about to fail yet again. I can no longer adjust the Brew temperatures. It still heats up and makes great espresso.
Whole Latte Love sent me a new temp controller, but it does not fit. It is 2 mm too wide. I will call them tomorrow. I think the part they sent is what they use in the Brewtus IV. Maybe I will get lucky & they will have the right part in stock. Maybe.

I like the espresso it makes. I think the steamer is just OK.
I suspect it can be fixed.

I opened it up and it looks like wired & the controllers are suffering heat damage.
I had to do significant internal repairs. WLL was good in the past with parts & advice.
But, I just want great espresso & latte without a need for periodic repairs.

What would you recommend?
If I can get the right part, I will repair it. Carefully.

I need the double boiler & an adjustable temperature controller. PID would be nice but not critical.
I more powerful steamer would be very nice.

PID or Not PID? Nearly all DBs have PIDs these days. Offhand I can't think of any of the usual suspects which don't; basically it's a non issue.

Total budget?

Are you plumbed in, or do you plan to plumb in?

Would you consider getting a better grinder as well? The grinder market has advanced a lot in the past few years, as well as the way we perceive the grinder's importance as a component in the system. You can do much better than a Mini.

If you're not plumbed in, for about the same money as a higher end prosumer, E61 DB, you could "step down" to a BDB, and getting a better grinder. Before you answer, it's not only a question of budget... most grinders better than a Mini are also a great deal larger. Also, the reason I put so much emphasis on plumbed to line in this case, is because E61 machines don't preinfuse well off a reservoir feed.

Rich

I am not plumbing in. The Brewtus II does pre infuse.
Probably "yes" to PID. The Brewtus II has a good temperature controller. People who replace with PID say there was no improvement. Other brands & designs my need a PID.

I have a Mazzer Mini. works fine. I would be open to a better new grinder. But, bigger is a problem. Are there good, newer, smaller grinders?
What would you suggest?

I am retired. My budget is constrained. I would want to minimize cost. But, it looks like good double boilers run close to $2000 or more. I would prefer less, but if that is what it will cost for a good reliable machine, then I will spend that.

Help me with the abbreviations. What is a BDB?

"If my Expobar Brewtus II dies, what should I get?" -- werbin,

Answer: A Brewtus IV?

Yes, DB (Double Boiler) espresso machines are from a low of around $2000 to around $2700-3000. And then you have the next class of machines up to around $7K.

You might look at the Quick Mill 67, as it is about $2K. And then a bit higher price-wise (and in nor particular order) check out ECM, Rocket, Izzo Alex Duetto, Faema, Profitec and Vibiemme. And then there's the Brewtus IV.

Of course, those prices are for NEW machines...buying a USED one in great shape -- when someone upgrades and no longer needs it -- is another option to save $$ but still get a solid machine. Or maybe an open-box/refurbished machine from one of the major espresso dealers/stores online (or a local brick & mortar espresso store if you have any in your city -- we don't here).

As for what "BDB" means, I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing that this 2013 Home Barista thread has the answer...to that and buying a used machine:

Breville Dual Boiler vs. used E61 HX espresso machine

Can't tell you anything about Breville since they were never on my Short List to begin with, mainly because they didn't have the "classic" look/construction of the other brands I listed above, and aren't Italian-made (as I prefer). But that's just me...

Good luck...

-- BR

I'll add Quickmill Vetrano 2B to the list! Had mine for a few weeks and no complaints.

Hy,

I opened this topic a While ago Expobar Brewtus or Quickmill QM67

After a lot of consideration I ordered Expobar Brewtus IV - vibration over QM67.

Why?

Mainly because of the price difference at the time 1150€ VS 1450€ for qm67. For the same price of qm67 I could get rotary Brewtus.

EXPOBAR BREWTUS IV:

+price
+2x 1.5 boiler
+heat exhanger for brew water through steam boiler
+almost no recovery time needed
+very large drip tray
+preinfusion from steam boiler pressure
+large quantity of hot water from hot water wand (0,5l is not a problem)
-pid for brew only
-not Italian
-not so aestetic


QUICKMILL QM67:

+double pid
+better look
+Italian
-brew boiler "only" 0,75l steam 0,95l
-limited hot water quantity
-price


I am now owner of Brewtus IV for 8 months and would never buy qm67 or even much more expensive Duetto, R58, Vetrano or double Domobar. My next step will probably be in range of GS3 or Slayer.

The main reason is that with brewtus I have much larger brew boiler than all previously mentioned machines and also preheated from steam boiler. Something you also get with GS3 (Duetto also has preheating of brew water I think).

About steaming. My steam boiler is set to 1,35 Bar. But with 4 hole steam tip from Nuova Simonelli, the steaming time is 60% faster and still very easy to use after few days of practice. For 1 cappuccino 15 seconds, for 2 cappuccinos around 30 seconds.

My machine is not plumbed so Expobars LARGE drip tray is something I could not live without. Lot larger than competiton.

I agree that the looks of more expensive competitors are nicer but for me specs are more important than looks. But it is still far from bad looking machine.

About quality I cant talk about reliability of other machines as I have not owned them but so far no problems, and since I am mechanical engineer I will do all maintenance by my self.

I am NOT saying that other machines are not god, far from that, but I am really happy with my expobar. The only thing missing is PID on steam boiler, but I can get new pressure stat for god price so that is not that big deal for me.

if I recall correctly the part you actually need can be gotten from these people:

Sorry I didn't answer sooner but it took me till now to find the correspondence.The part you need is an AKO-13120/01. Contact jdaigneault@furneco.com or go to their website http://www.furneco.com/ The part is 40 but they carged me 102 to send it overnight UPS. See if you can arrange cheaper mailing.

That message is from the Brewtus list in 2009 so the price has likely gone up a bit but it's the same part without the Brewtus customizations.

The differences are:

it will show overshoot which the original was not allowed to do.

When it arrives it will be set up for use in a freezer and you'll have to change the setting that makes it work for an oven.

I've helped a few people with that and it's about a 30 second process.

Ira

As for the grinder, if you want bigger burrs you could go for a Super Jolly. OR, you could install SJ burrs in your mini. I don't think the SJ clumps as bad as the mini.. no idea why, every time I see grounds from a Mini they just look super clumpy.. I'd imagine it has something to do with the smaller surface area. The SJ is not that bigger than the Mini, but if space is a big problem the latter might be a good idea.

The Brewtus IV seems reasonably priced, I might look into one if I ever have an upgrade urge.. I do however prefer the steaming power of the other E61s like the Rocket though. I saw a video of the Brewtus IV steaming last night.. it was very lack luster.. my Oscar slaughters it (~12 seconds), reminds me of the Silvia's steam power. I think the Rocket's look great their R58 is nice so I hear, but I'm an HX guy so I'd probably go for one of the other ones.

It seems to me that replacing all the internal components that could fail might take considerable time and it might seem daunting but the newer double boiler machines aren't that different than the one you have. I'd wonder whether it's worth the money to start over with a new machine.

Thanks everyone for the good info.
Here is the current status.

I spoke to Todd Salzman the chief Brewtus repair / tech guy at Whole Latte Love.
Yes, they had sent me the display/temp controller they now use in the Brewtus IV.
No, they no longer stock the AKO display / controller that was used in the Brewtus II. He said there was probably a company in Canada that might still stock it.

Yes, there is a way to make the newer Gicar controller fit in the Brewtus II. (remove 2 screws, pull off outer case, push it through the hole in the Brewtus II and then put the outer case back on).

No it will not work in the Brewtus II unless I get the rest of their PID upgrade kit.

I decided to do that. Total cost $250 and it should work. I think the conversion will take me about an hour.
It sounds like people who got a Brewtus IV are very happy.
Talking to Todd, it sounded like I could get a substantially better new machine for about $2800.
But, for $250, I should have a machine that is close in functionality to a Brewtus IV with a PID.

If I have problems again, I will return to this thread and investigate some of the other machines.