Ok, here's the deal. I think I have it pretty good. I live just a couple blocks from a really good espresso place. Mornings on the way to work, more often on weekends, it's quite easy to stop in and get my fix. I also work near another good place, so at lunch or on the way home, another stop and I'm set. The boss at home stops in at her convenience, so we're both happy. Never felt the need for a machine at home when good stuff is just a minute away. Well, an opportunity came up and I accepted a new job that will take me away from here and stick me smack dab in the middle of northern Nevada. Best option there is a McCafe . So, the next step is pretty obvious. Time to set aside some counter space for a fancy water pump.

Here's the skinny on all the basics you're gonna ask:
• Experience - Does pushing the brew button on a Mr. Coffee count?
• Typical use - Mornings I like a shot or two plus a big mondo excessively huge American type milk drink for the drive to work. Afternoons usually one or two iced drinks (doubles in all of those). Same for the missus, so probably average 15 or so shots a day? Gotta be able to steam well with all the milk drinks we do.
• Budget - I'm thinking of putting my budget somewhere near 3k for everything. That includes not only the machine and grinder, but all the accessories needed (tamper, baskets, pitchers, filtration, etc.) So basically 2500 for espresso machine and grinder.

While I'm "allowed" to set the budget wherever I want, the only caveat is that she has to approve of the aesthetics. This is both good and bad news. She thinks the machines themselves look cool, so I'm free to choose whatever. As for grinders, though, she's pretty sure they are the ugliest things this side of that prized deer I got when I was 12 and had mounted and put on the wall in all of my living rooms for the 25 years before we met.....but I digress. In order to go forward with this purchase I had to sit her down in front of the computer, show her all the usual suspects, and get a rundown of crazy lady approved grinders. I have a list of - count 'em - four choices. Luckily, although you wouldn't know it by looking at me, she has rather good taste. My four choices are the Baratza Vario, Compak A-8 Automatic, Mahlkonig ProM, and the big daddy Mahlkonig K30 (I don't think she realizes how big it is....shhhhhh). I got really giddy over her list, but then remembered my budget and pretty much decided on the Vario so I could get into a nice rotary.

Now the search moved on to the machine. Some of the things I want:
• Rotary pump
• Plumbable
• Excellent steaming ability
• Gotta be able to put it on a timer (I'm not a morning person. At all.)
• ?????? (I mentioned I was a complete newbie, right?)

With the above in mind, I started looking at the machines and came up with a short list.
• La Spaz VII
• Quick Mill Vetrano
• Rocket Cellini Pro(can't see spending the extra hundred just to get the bigger hips on the Giotto.)
• VBM Domobar Super

I also looked at the Izzo Alex and Expobar Brutus, but for some reason I can't get excited about those. Not sure why, a lot of people like them, but they just don't do it for me. I'm also not too keen on the idea of getting used. Plus I think I'm really close to crossing the VII off the list. It's already at the top of my budget, and the fact that the timer it needs is another 2 bills really makes my wallet cry.

I've read all the posts on Hx vs DB, and have come to the conclusion that I'll be happy either way, so that isn't a consideration.

So anyway, did I mention I can be long winded? I guess what I'm looking for is advice in the 1800 - 2200 price range for an absolutely new newbie. Any reason I should pick one over the other? Any of these more forgiving for a virgin, or somewhere else I should be looking?

I'd love to hear any and all thoughts. Thanks for helping me in my "Holy Hell did I really spend that much money for some coffee????" quest.

At your price range, the players will be pretty similar. The Vario is a capable grinder and has the highest WAF of any grinder that I've seen. IIRC all of these machines have vacuum breakers, so adding a timer is trivial.

I'd encourage you to find a vendor who will provide word-class support during and after sale. Several vendors have been recognized here on HB for their level of service; you'd do well to call them up and see how they respond to you.

If there is ANY way for you to get your hands on one, do that FIRST. There is no substitute for seeing one of these gleaming beasts in the flesh.

Although over your budget if purchasing new, there is a LaCimbali Jr Casa on CG's Buy, Sell, Trade Forum that is only 6 months old, has warranty remaining, and is currently offered for $2300. If you want a machine that should outlast any of the ones you mentioned while still meeting your price point, you might want to check it out. Also, given your upcoming remote location, I'm guessing you want as reliable a machine as possible. According to the Chris Coffee, this is his recommended 20-year plus machine if you can swing the $$. Looks-wise it may not be your thing as it's pretty conservative, but it should blend in the kitchen nicely. Add a Vario, tamper, tamping pad, knockbox (or use your sink's garbage disposal for free) and you are still under your $3k budget.

For disclosure, I have no ties to the seller of this machine.

Where are you in Utah? I am in Ogden if you want to give a lever machine a shot.

First timer with good budget, I would say forget HX and go for double-boiler with PID, Vibiemme Domobar Super Double Boiler sounds very good. Why get involved in flushing voodoo rituals when you can simply set it and forget it? I'd never pick HX over double boiler and I tried multiple HX and double-boiler machines...

I'm very pleased with my La Spaz, the dosing is great, lots of steam, accurate temps etc. I know others praise their E61 machines just as highly, so you will just have to weigh the pros and cons of each. Visual aesthetics usually play a role also, as you are finding out.
I have a Mahlkonig K30 as well as a Baratza Vario (for a setup at a second home), and I have to say I'm not a fan of the Baratza. Yes it is compact and capable, but I have gotten better (more accurate and finer adjustment of grind) results with the K30, and even with the Mazzer I had prior to that. Many enthusiasts will recommend focus on the grinder while deciding on a setup purchase, I like a balanced approach, and feel you can do better than the Baratza for a match to the espresso machines you are considering. I ultimately anticipate getting rid of my Baratza and upgrading to one of the other major grinders.

+ 1 on the La Spaziale Vivaldi II. I love mine. I run it on a Flo-Jet and a 5-gallon jug. Great temperature stability/changeability, programmable pre-infusion and programmable dosage. Easy to use and very flexible. Great steamer and hot water delivery. Its' own website of enthusiasts: http://www.s1cafe.com. Chris' Coffee Service has been great to work with before, during and after the sale.

I went into analysis paralysis when researching machines. The LS VII and Chris' Coffee Service has been the right choice for me.

Good luck.

Todd

Yeah, the La Spaz was originally my first choice. But given the fact that it is 300-500 more than the others I'm looking at, plus their special fancy dancy timer is another 200, that reeeeaaaaaallly hurts it's chances. The Cimbali is very intriguing. Gonna have to see what Miss Picky says about its look. She was kinda lukewarm on the Vivaldi because it didn't look like a "normal" machine , so who knows.

I do know that I'd like to go through Chris' Coffee if they have the setup I ultimately go with. From everything I've read, their service both before and after a purchase is top of the line, and that counts for a lot in my book. If I go with the VBM, though, Chris' doesn't have it. Anyone know how 1st Line is?

Finally, (not finally finally, but finally for this post), I haven't seen much at all as far as reviews of the Compak A-8 goes. I'm assuming it's a great grinder based on the reviews of the K8 which seems to have pretty much the same guts. That is her favorite grinder as far as looks go, but I don't think she realizes how big it is (again, shhhhhh ).

Grinders:
I'm sure the A-8 Automatic will be very convenient to use. But the king of the hill for Compak is the K-10 Pro Barista. And that's where Compak got its fame from.

Get a conical grinder if you can. The Compak K-10 is conical. The K-8 / A-8 has flat burrs. Totally different. You can't extrapolate from the K-10 reviews to the K-8. Completely different guts, especially where it counts (in the burrs).

But if you want pretty and convenience, A-8 Automatic.

As for grinders, though, she's pretty sure they are the ugliest things this side of that prized deer I got when I was 12 and had mounted and put on the wall in all of my living rooms for the 25 years before we met.....but I digress.

Or you could mount your prized deer head above the coffee setup and then everything else will look pretty in comparison. Smoke and mirrors, man. .....but I digress.

LOL. I've put the deer back up a couple times to re-man-ify the place after she picked out some frilly crap, but as soon as I regain consciousness I notice it's put back in the garage.

I'd go with the Cellini (slight bias here, as i own one) or Domobar. Get a heavy duty timer from the hardware store and you are done. I do about 4-5 cappuccinos a day so i can relate to needing some steaming power.