Hello All (newbie here),

First of all, let me say that this website has been great. I have learned so much about what the different aspects of what good espresso making is. From the espresso machine, to the grinder, to the coffee to the roasting process. Can't say how many hours I have spent watching videos and reading comments. Awesome.

Well, now that I am very close to pulling the trigger on a espresso machine + grinder combination I want to cross some t's and dot those i's. I have read a significant number of posts that state, Grinder! Grinder! Grinder!. With the motto in mind I went to the very best (at least by many in HB standards) the Malkonig K30. I have this grinder quoted and in line for purchase but before I pull the trigger I wanted to know what I am gaining with this grinder compared to a Baratza Forte. The price difference is significant as well as the real estate space on my counter. Also, I will only use this equipment for my home, 3-4 espresso per day, no rush setting. How much bang for the buck Im I getting by going from the Forte to the Malhkonig?

All I care is the value in the cup (not so much the speed).

Thanks in advance!

Javier

If you want the K30 then should wait another month and get the Mahlkonig Peak. Im waiting for it too. Or at least better info that might make me rule it out.

It's important to consider how you're planning on using the grinder? Single dosing vs. Hopper feeding?

Some grinders do both well. Others are better suited for one or the other.

I only single dose. I change beans A LOT. And I'm the only coffee drinker in my house. So hopper feeding doesn't make sense for me.

But if you make many successive shots, and stick with one bean for a while, hopper feeding might be the trick.

Depends on your expected routine.

I like single dose. My volume is not a lot.

I just want to know if going "professional" with the Malhkonig K30 is worth it compared to a Baratza Forte. What Im I gaining with this upgrade?

As a former Vario owner, currrent Compak K10 PB owner and single doser, I think I may be able to shed some light. I'm also a low volume drinker (I live alone) and single doser. I chnage beans frequently as well. Here are some of the improvements I have personally experienced in my 6 months of Compak ownership

1) Fluffier, more consistent grinds.
2) Less pre-tamp fuss (Tapping, WDT)
3) Grind settings never alter
4) Smaller adjustments when changing beans.
5) Doser helps break up any clumps which may appear (although the K30 dosn't have a doser, so moot)
6) Larger burr set which translates to added speed and consistency

When you get to the level of grinder we are talking about here, actual and perceived value increase begins to diminish vs. talking about moving from a $90 Capresso grinder to a Baratza Vario/Forte. Without knowing what machine you're buying, it's hard to say how much value you will perceive. I also don't know your income. I can say this though....my biggest regret with espresso is "testing the water" with a Vario and Silvia. I feel like I threw that money away. If you feel like you're "all-in" on home espresso and can bear the monetary burden of it, I think in the end you'll be very happy with the grinder upgrade. What you miss by buying it now as opposed to buying a Forte and upgrading in a year is truly knowing, first hand, what you gained with the K30.

YMMV

I have owned a Baratza Vario but not Forte and am using a K30 now. My understanding is that in the cup qualities of Vario and Forte are similar. The K30 is better in the cup. That's what you're paying for. So, I would not consider it a fair comparison. If you have the funds and appreciate well-pulled espresso, I think it makes sense (as much sense as anything we do...) to get a commercial grinder.

That said, there are many many excellent options for commercial grinders -- including other big flats and conicals. I don't think it is justified to call the K30 the "very best." I thought it was the right choice for me given my habits (I use the hopper, make a half-dozen drinks quickly while barely awake each weekday, and prefer traditional espresso blends), but it sounds like you may want to consider other commercial options. If you single dose, I would argue the hb community has voted with its feet for the Compak K10 PB as among the "very best"; it's a large conical with a doser so a different experience than the K30. The HG-1 (also conical) gets many votes as "very best" as another approach to single-dose conical; it's a hand grinder. There are several other big flats -- with and without doser -- that cost less than the K30. And, as noted, the PEAK is coming.

In sum, I don't understand why you are comparing Forte v K30. I could understand Forte v HG-1 (~same price) or K30 v [insert other commercial grinder]. That said, if you've decided the K30 is for you, based on my month-long experience, I wouldn't try to talk you out of it.

DanSF wrote:I wouldn't try to talk you out of it.

+1

Thanks for the reply.

I understand that everyone agrees that these two grinders are in their separate categories. I guess my question was regarding bang for buck. Whether one can notice the difference in the cup between these two grinders. I mainly ask given the price difference between the two and the fact that I am not going to put a lot of demand on the grinder. I was trying to figure out mainly if the differences were due to capability to produce a significant number of shots without: 1. heating up and 2. at a speed required to satisfy the customers. Understanding that if these were the only two advantages then in my case, I would not need the higher end grinder. But... if the difference is in terms of consistency, and overall better grind that produces better shots... then yes.. it might be worth it.

I just mentioned the K30 because that is the grinder I am leaning towards... I understands that there are many others and separate threads that debate the attributes of each... I just wanted a comparison between the mid level grinder vs high end level grinder...

what I get from your comments is that: 1. you can notice a difference in the cup 2. you need a good enough machine to actually take advantage of this extra benefit 3. if you can pay for it go for it 4. it is better to go all in than slowly upgrade (less money in the long run)

The consensus is that the K30 is superior to the Forte in the cup. However, I haven't used a K30.

I do have a Vario and a Compak K10PB. The K10PB is noticeably better in the cup. The Forte does grind faster than a Vario, but I don't know if that affects the cup.

Obviously there are big ergonomic differences between a Forte and K30. The Forte is compact, has a small footprint and has almost zero retention. It's suited to both hopper and single dosing.

Others would have to comment on the K30. But it has a sterling reputation among home and pro baristas.

If you're strictly judging on taste, you can do better than a Forte. But it depends on your priorities.

I considered a K30 but like others i'm waiting for the good folks at HB to get their hands on the PEAK. However, the k30 is a staple around here and I doubt you'd be disappointed. The Forte on the other hand (and I'm projecting using my knowledge of the Vario), would be doable if you favored convenience over everything else.