Hi Gang-
Im a total newbie been reading the forums to try to figure out what machine to get my husband for his birthday. I've obsessed over this for a while now and here is what I've come up with: Either a Used Vibiemme Super HX Tank Domobar (2006 manufacture demo) or a new Bezzera BZ02S or Bezzera BZ07spm. Can't believe I'm considering spending this much (about 1,000) but want to be able to serve 6 cups or more of cap. when we entertain. Started by looking at the Silvia but that purchase might lead to rapid onset upgraditis. The Vibiemme looks awesome but concerned about used aspect.

Do you already have an espresso-capable grinder or does that need to be factored into your budget?

As others will tell you, a good grinder is as important - if not more so - than the machine for good espresso production.

What do you (or your husband) anticipate making mostly? If you'll use the steamer infrequently (i.e. don't make a lot of steamed-milk drinks) then I think the Silvia is the way to go plus a good grinder like a Vario or Rocky. The combo will come in right about $1000.

As I see it, the Silvia has the most potential as it's a real boiler machine (i.e. no thermoblock) and, if you don't need steam, is readily adaptable to PID control for the silvia's only real weak point which is temperature control. The other features of the Silvia, including the full-sized (58mm E61 grouphead) and overall robust construction aren't matched by anything else in its price rance.

On the other hand, if you're going to be making lattes or cappuccinos or steaming a lot of milk in general, the single boiler gets real old, real fast and that rules out Silvia. But to get the equivalent of Silvia's base espresso making capability, you're going to need to spend at least $1.5K on a good HX machine like the Livia and, once you're there, you might as well spend $2.1K and get a real dual-boiler machine with PID.

See? it sucks.

For entertaining, when that many drinks (or more) will be made for company, FORGET the Silvia. If the Vibiemme is the Domobar Super lever operated machine, and it is the stainless model that could be a good choice if it has been well maintained and not fed a diet of very hard water. If it is a black model, check carefully for rust under the brackets that hold up the drip tray. They are very capable machines and can make drinks for you all night long.

As has been mentioned- a high quality grinder with that machine (or any machine really, particularly in the price rage in which you are shopping) is a must.

And don't be embarrassed or shocked about spending that much on an espresso machine. BTDT

Thanks all. Randi good comments. So you think I'm better off with the Vibbi than the Bezzeras. BTW its the Vibbi Super HX.

nitpick wrote: The other features of the Silvia, including the full-sized (58mm E61 grouphead)

Its not an E61 on the Silvia, but it is on the Vibiemme. If its in good condition, the Domobar Super is a great machine with heaps of steam power for churning out milk drinks. But as mentioned, its a waste of time if you don't have a good grinder. The Vario does indeed seem to be the flavour of the month/year in that category.

For the price of one Vibiemme, you can get three Silvias. Now how much coffee can you make at a time?

nitpick wrote:For the price of one Vibiemme, you can get three Silvias.

Three Silvias and a grinder will be right at the edge of a common kitchen 20A circuit's capacity.

That seems like a lot of hassle to steam one pitcher of milk while brewing on two groups.

nitpick wrote:For the price of one Vibiemme, you can get three Silvias. Now how much coffee can you make at a time?

For a lot less than the price of a Silvia you can get a brick which makes a much better paperweight than Silvia, and costs a LOT less. Heck- you could probably build a BBQ with the bricks you could get for the cost of a Silvia.

The Silvia is a toy compared to the three machines the OP is considering. It is even less valuable when entertaining a group of people. I can say that because I have owned a Silvia and now own a Vibiemme Domobar Super. I have had the chance to compare the two. When the Vibiemme was on the way to me I considered keeping the PID'd Silvia, but after the first two or three drinks from the Vibiemme, the Silvia was for sale. Two different worlds.

Current new prices:
Vibiemme Domobar Super manual in black: $1700 (used $1000)
BZ07spm - $1099
BZ02S - $950

Based on the quality of the grouphead alone, the Vibiemme would be on the top of my list. But as I mentioned earlier, it must be checked out, or maybe get a three day return option in writing. Alternately, give your husband a "Gift Certificate" and allow him to check it out before deciding if he is capable of doing so. Or maybe the seller can deliver, set up, and allow your husband to use it before deciding...

Again, I have not used the Bezzera machines, and I do own the Vibiemme, so take my prejudices into consideration.

nitpick wrote:For the price of one Vibiemme, you can get three Silvias.

The Bezzera BZ02S is on sale for $949 versus the Rancilio Silvia at $649. If you opt for a PID (electronic temperature controller) for the Silvia as many do, add $150 (Auber) to $290 (pidkits) and your time for doing the modification. The Bezzera can steam and brew at the same time; the Silvia cannot. According to Jim Schulman, the Bezzera is easy to use and pulls shots on par with his beloved Elektra Semiautomatica that costs almost twice as much. The Rancilio Silvia has many fans, but in my opinion, there are better options.