Hi All,

I am in the midst of deciding my first espresso machine and would like to ask your help on certain matters.

I am trying to decide between Bezzera Mitica and Bezzera BZ13. I have spent some time going through the specifications/reviews for both of them.
-- The first difference is ofcourse the group head. BZ13 has the bezzera-built and Mitica the standard E61. My question is should i prefer E61 considering it would be easier to replace than a bezzera-built grouphead?
-- Startup time : I also read that on an average, the Mitica takes about 15-20 minutes and for BZ13, apparently Bezzera have some sort of thermostat placed on the group head resulting in faster startup time( they say around 8 minutes ). Maybe this is a newbie question, but I am more leaned towards BZ13 because of its startup time. Does it make much sense?
-- Appearance : I know that there are more areas which are of importance with an espresso machine, but it just seems like Mitica has a way more calm look than the BZ13. I can live with it but thats just a thought

Really appreciate your help

Thanks and Cheers
Suhas

My commentary might be a bit irrelevant, but doesn't the Mitica offer the double of pressure upon brewing? BZ13 has many other deficiencies compared to Mitica, I'm not sure finding a second hand one worth the effort, is not like you are getting a Pavoni, second hand Bezzera here sounds just like second hand - but I might be completely biased.

They can both provide sufficient pressure desirable for espresso. I agree with MyCchiato, the mitica is a pretty good upgrade over the BZ13, it has rotary pump, commercial thermostat, larger boiler, larger reservoir, and can be purchased in a plumbable version. But If small size and faster heat up times are priority, the BZ13 may be a better option. If small size not important, but heat up times are, then maybe consider putting mitica on a timer or just leaving on all the time. Apparently E61's don't use much more power, if any more, when just left on all the time. My concern is catastrophic failure when no one is home. If you have good insurance though, maybe worth the risk?

HoldTheOnions wrote:I agree with MyCchiato, the mitica is a pretty good upgrade over the BZ13, it has rotary pump, commercial thermostat, larger boiler, larger reservoir, and can be purchased in a plumbable version.

There are several different versions of Mitica. The one with switchable water source has rotary pump while the cheaper ones have a vibratory pump.

sujhas wrote:Hi All,

I am in the midst of deciding my first espresso machine and would like to ask your help on certain matters.

I am trying to decide between Bezzera Mitica and Bezzera BZ13. I have spent some time going through the specifications/reviews for both of them.
-- The first difference is ofcourse the group head. BZ13 has the bezzera-built and Mitica the standard E61. My question is should i prefer E61 considering it would be easier to replace than a bezzera-built grouphead?
-- Startup time : I also read that on an average, the Mitica takes about 15-20 minutes and for BZ13, apparently Bezzera have some sort of thermostat placed on the group head resulting in faster startup time( they say around 8 minutes ). Maybe this is a newbie question, but I am more leaned towards BZ13 because of its startup time. Does it make much sense?
-- Appearance : I know that there are more areas which are of importance with an espresso machine, but it just seems like Mitica has a way more calm look than the BZ13. I can live with it but thats just a thought

Really appreciate your help

Thanks and Cheers
Suhas

I have the Bezzera Magica. The Magica is also an E61 HX, but it has a vibratory pump and is not plumbable. Otherwise it's basically the same as the Mitica.

The Magica is great. I've had it for close to 2 years. It's well constructed with high quality materials. Bezzera machines don't get enough attention in my view.

It also steams like a beast with the 2.0 liter copper boiler. In fact, for small amounts of milk it can be too strong if you don't have good technique. I don't actually make many milk drinks, mostly straight shots.

However, all E61 machines need 45 to 60 minutes to fully warm up. The boiler will be up to temp in under 10 minutes. But because of the thermosyphon flow to the group, it will take much longer to achieve full temperature stability.

What will be your daily routine? How many drinks and what kind? Milk?

The other Bezzera "BZ" series of machines use the proprietary Bezzera/Elektra bell grouphead. The bell grouphead is said to produce shots with greater clarity whereas E61 group shots are known for greater body. The BZ machines also don't like updosing your basket. I haven't used the BZ machines. I've just seen them in person.

The BZ machines, as you said, have electrically heated groupheads. So they heat up much faster. I've read they're ready in closer to 20 minutes.

All of these machines are HXs. So they will require a cooling flush routine. From what I've read, the BZ machines require a shorter cooling flush than the E61s.

Also, don't forget about getting a good espresso grinder. That's very important. It doesn't matter how good your machine is if you don't have a quality espresso grinder. So what's your budget for a grinder?

My commentary might be a bit irrelevant, but doesn't the Mitica offer the double of pressure upon brewing?

MyCchiato wrote:BZ13 has many other deficiencies compared to Mitica,

what kind of deficiencies are you referring to ?

canuckcoffeeguy wrote:I have the Bezzera Magica. The Magica is also an E61 HX, but it has a vibratory pump and is not plumbable. Otherwise it's basically the same as the Mitica.

The Magica is great. I've had it for close to 2 years. It's well constructed with high quality materials. Bezzera machines don't get enough attention in my view.

It also steams like a beast with the 2.0 liter copper boiler. In fact, for small amounts of milk it can be too strong if you don't have good technique. I don't actually make many milk drinks, mostly straight shots.

However, all E61 machines need 45 to 60 minutes to fully warm up. The boiler will be up to temp in under 10 minutes. But because of the thermosyphon flow to the group, it will take much longer to achieve full temperature stability.

What will be your daily routine? How many drinks and what kind? Milk?

The other Bezzera "BZ" series of machines use the proprietary Bezzera/Elektra bell grouphead. The bell grouphead is said to produce shots with greater clarity whereas E61 group shots are known for greater body. The BZ machines also don't like updosing your basket. I haven't used the BZ machines. I've just seen them in person.

The BZ machines, as you said, have electrically heated groupheads. So they heat up much faster. I've read they're ready in closer to 20 minutes.

All of these machines are HXs. So they will require a cooling flush routine. From what I've read, the BZ machines require a shorter cooling flush than the E61s.

Also, don't forget about getting a good espresso grinder. That's very important. It doesn't matter how good your machine is if you don't have a quality espresso grinder. So what's your budget for a grinder?

Thanks for the reply!
Well my daily routine would be 3-4 cups .. I like cappuccino's so i would do a couple with milk and the others espresso.. honestly, i am a little put-off by the number 45-60 min. Or is it just me that being too optimistic/impatient about the start-up time ? My impression was that i switch on the machine when i wake up and by the time am done with the daily routine, machine's up and running.. So yeah, i was hoping for a fast startup machine. But if it means sacrificing this for a quality machine, i guess i can do that.

You are right.. i am reading about the grinders and at the moment i am planning to get the Quamar Q80E.. My budget for the grinder, i am willing to spend around 550€, i think i get a good grinder for that right ? do you have any specific recommendations? also i couldnt make a conclusion of the discussion between conical and flat burrs. for a newbie, how important is this ?

HoldTheOnions wrote:They can both provide sufficient pressure desirable for espresso. I agree with MyCchiato, the mitica is a pretty good upgrade over the BZ13, it has rotary pump, commercial thermostat, larger boiler, larger reservoir, and can be purchased in a plumbable version. But If small size and faster heat up times are priority, the BZ13 may be a better option. If small size not important, but heat up times are, then maybe consider putting mitica on a timer or just leaving on all the time. Apparently E61's don't use much more power, if any more, when just left on all the time. My concern is catastrophic failure when no one is home. If you have good insurance though, maybe worth the risk?

Good to know, thanks!
Am not sure if i will be keeping the machine running when am off to work
I have heard quite a bit about e61s, but i am not able to find much info on the BZ group-heads and their performance/ replacing convenience and things like that.. in general, the performance.

sujhas wrote:honestly, i am a little put-off by the number 45-60 min. Or is it just me that being too optimistic/impatient about the start-up time ? My impression was that i switch on the machine when i wake up and by the time am done with the daily routine, machine's up and running.. So yeah, i was hoping for a fast startup machine. But if it means sacrificing this for a quality machine, i guess i can do that.

The warm up time is nothing to worry about if you have a timer.

I have a WeMo timer so my machine is always fully warmed up when I wake up. You can program different schedules for each day/scenarios, and control it remotely with your smartphone. Lots of people on HB use them and haven't had any trouble:
http://m.belkin.com/us/F7C029/p/P-F7C029/

If they aren't available in Europe, there must be another similar product.
Edit: here's the Dutch link
http://www.belkin.nl/f7c029eanl-belkin- ... witch.html

sujhas wrote: You are right.. i am reading about the grinders and at the moment i am planning to get the Quamar Q80E.. My budget for the grinder, i am willing to spend around 550€, i think i get a good grinder for that right ? do you have any specific recommendations? also i couldnt make a conclusion of the discussion between conical and flat burrs. for a newbie, how important is this ?

Yeah you can get a capable grinder for that amount. The conical vs flat debate is endless. Do a search on this site for that topic and you'll get many results.

What kind of coffee will you be making? Light, medium, or dark roasts? Blends or single origins.

In terms of recommendations, what grinders are actually available where you are? Can you provide any websites for retailers you're considering?