I was wondering if anyone was using one of these, or considered doing so? http://www.beanvac.com/

What I quite like about it is that it self monitors, so that if the vacuum decreases, it will fire up the pump and de-gas, which for fresh coffee is surely a good thing. It's a bit pricey though.

I looked at that but ended up getting these which I love!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00167XN14

Interesting design which achieves almost the same thing. It's simple and good.

I tend to disagree with their motto: the "ultimate coffee canister" is:


Mason Jar

Stored here:

Coffee: To Freeze or Not to Freeze

Yeah, I store my roasted beans in 8 oz jelly jar sized canning jars in the freezer. I buy them by the case at Orchard Supply Hardware.

I picked up some plastic lids that I use for beans that won't be frozen (because they're not airtight) and are easier to write on with a grease pencil. I use these beans up in a week or two max.

If you think about it, why would you want to pull all of the CO2 out of fresh roasted beans by pumping a vacuum on them? Not to mention aromatics, etc. A good container should be easy to use, have a moisture/air barrier cap, and not cost an arm and a leg. We use TightVacs in the coffee corner and yes, mason jars in the freezer.
Look at the retailers list...not exactly coffee insiders. The Sharper Image?

I have had one in daily use for about 2 months. I only store about 3-4 days worth at a time, opening once a day in the morning, then leaving it sealed under vacuum the remaining 22-23 hours. I have the switch set to not activate the vacuum after 12, 24, etc hours, but the vacuum stays intact for the whole day. I haven't noticed any great benefits nor detriments to the flavor, compared to my old ceramic canister with a silicon lid. There may or may not be better or worse results with greater quantities that are stored for longer periods, but I'm not too interested in experimenting with them. I store 3-4 days portions in the freezer, and pull out some when I need them; in this context, staling even when exposed to oxygen is tolerable.

The experience with it: Bought for me as a gift. The first one was DOA, with a bad circuit board. The company was fast to replace it, and the second one has worked great. The one time it failed to maintain a vacuum was when a bit of chaff got on the seal and created a leak. brushing it off fixed that. The quality seems good, and everything works well. I do not like the idea of storing coffee in plastic, but haven't noticed any off flavors as a result.

Based on my experience and usage pattern, I'm not sure I'd recommend one necessarily, but anything that can help maintain a reduced oxygen environment is good, IMO. Doug mentions possible detriments to coffee flavor that might be a product of the vacuum "pulling" CO2 out of the beans. I do not know of any good data on that effect, but there is quite good data on the detrimental effects of oxidation. I believe vacuum does not do a good job of pulling the CO2 out, based on my experience with freezing beans in mason jars under vacuum. They do not lose the vacuum, which leads me to believe that the CO2 is not being pulled out of the beans, but my logic may be faulty. There is some data in the food science literature that indicates coffee is acceptable for longer periods when packaged under vacuum than when in air. But that's for regular coffee (sometimes) judged by regular consumers, not for quality coffee judged by tasters like us.

Maybe I should send my Coffee Bean Vac to Jim or Ken for some hard-core testing. Actually I may be visiting Jim this summer so maybe I'll just bring it with me.

danaleighton wrote:Based on my experience and usage pattern, I'm not sure I'd recommend one necessarily, but anything that can help maintain a reduced oxygen environment is good, IMO. Doug mentions possible detriments to coffee flavor that might be a product of the vacuum "pulling" CO2 out of the beans. I do not know of any good data on that effect, but there is quite good data on the detrimental effects of oxidation.

Without a doubt, oxidation is one of the chemical reactions which degrades fresh foodstuffs, but the role it plays in coffee staling is not entirely clear, at least not to me.

My take on using consumer vacuum packaging devices is this:

(1) they have no proven benefit in the preservation of coffee, either green or roasted;
(2) they have no proven detriment in the preservation of coffee, either green or roasted;
(3) they do not produce a "real vacuum" nor do they eliminate most all the oxygen that was present, in the way that industrial vacuum packaging devices do. Industrial vacuum packaging devices cost a fortune and are not intended for home use;
(4) fairly rigorous testing on this website (coffee freezing studies) demonstrate very good results, e.g. no detectable difference, between fresh/never frozen and previously frozen roasted coffee when used for espresso. Anecdotal evidence from a huge number of people on this site and elsewhere supports these findings. Given those results, which do not require the use of vacuum packaging, the added value of vacuum packaging is open to question.
(5) extensive anecdotal evidence both from boutique roasters and importers, plus consumers, implies that simple freezing of green coffee without any sort of vacuum preserves green coffee for a long time at a level of quality not seriously below what it was before freezing. Room temperature storage does not accomplish this, although some storage media and methods are better than others. To the extent that vacuums are used in the industry, and seem to have benefit, this is with industrial vacuum equipment, not home devices.

I know of no proven or even accepted value of the use of consumer vacuum packaging in the storage of either green or roasted coffee, that will extend the usable period of storage for said coffees, even though there are a number of people on this site who are enthusiastic about this approach.

ken

It's great to get such well considered responses - thanks for that. I wonder then, if there is an interplay between oxygen and temperature, with temperature perhaps being the catalyst, or accelerant for the process of staling.

Yes, from the food science literature I've read, temperature (and its related property, light), is considered a detriment to coffee flavor mainly because of its role as a catalyst to oxidation. In coffee staling studies, heat is used as a proxy to simulate extended time in storage.

(Edit)
After pulling up the review article I most recently read, it appears that a vacuum, especially a partial vacuum which maintains some amount of residual oxygen might theoretically be a problem for roasted coffee staling. It is related to the pressure gradient that exists between the pores in the beans and the surface of the bean. This gradient might be responsible for the migration of lipids to the surface, which are then subject to oxidation. Thus, Doug's idea about pulling CO2 (and aromatics) out is correct, especially as it might also impel the migration of lipids to the surface. Here's the relevant paragraph (from page 161):

Volatiles and CO2 are easily released into the vapor phase due to diffusion mechanisms enhanced by the fact that the pressure inside the bean pores is greater than atmospheric pressure. The evolution of CO2 is of particular importance because, although, it can be considered an index of the aroma richness of roasted coffee, if released after coffee packaging it produces over-pressure inside the package with possible bursting and loss of package integrity. The presence of a pressure gradient between bean pores and exterior is also responsible for the migration of lipids, together with their lipophilic solutes, onto the bean surface. As a consequence of the increased exposed surface area, these compounds become more prone to oxidation. Volatile and CO2 release, together with oxidation reactions, are considered the main causes of coffee staling. In fact, the development of the typical stale flavor of aged coffee is the result of two different phenomena: the release of volatiles in the vapor phase and the development of off- flavor as the result of oxidation of some of them

This paragraph references Illy's edited volume: Nicoli MC, Savonitto O (2005) The raw bean. In: Viani R, Illy A (eds) Espresso coffee: the science of quality. Elsevier Academic Press, San Diego

The article is: Nicoli, M. C., Calligaris, S., & Manzocco, L. (2009). Shelf-Life testing of coffee and related products: Uncertainties, pitfalls, and perspectives. Food Engineering Review, 1(2), 159-168.
The full text of this article is available on Springerlink: http://www.springerlink.com/content/f42...lltext.pdf